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Title: Notes and Queries, Number 35, June 29, 1850 - A Medium of Inter-communication for Literary Men, Artists, - Antiquaries, Genealogists, etc
Author: Various
Language: English
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       *       *       *       *       *

"When found, make a note of."--CAPTAIN CUTTLE.

       *       *       *       *       *

No. 35.]
SATURDAY, JUNE 29. 1850.
[Price, with index to Vol. I., 9d. Stamped Edition 11d.

       *       *       *       *       *


  NOTES:--                                                Page
    George Goring, Earl of Norwich, and his Son George,
      Lord Goring                                          65
    MSS. of Bishop Ridley                                  66
    Lines written during the Arctic Expedition             67
    Folk Lore:--Legend of Sir Richard Baker, surnamed
      Bloody Baker--Cures for Warts--Charm for Cure of
      King's Evil--Fig-Sunday                              67
    Note on a Passage in Hudibras                          68
    Coffee, Black Broth                                    69

    Queries concerning Old MSS., by E. F. Rimbault         70
    Minor Queries:--Chantrey's Sleeping Children in
      Lichfield Cathedral--Viscount Dundee's Ring--Kilkenny
      Cats--Robert de Welle--Lady Slingsby--God
      save the Queen--Meaning of "Steyne"--Origin of
      "Adur"--Colonel Lilburn--French Verses--Our
      World--Porson's Imposition--Alice Rolle--The
      Meaning of "Race" in Ship-building--The Battle
      of Death--Execution of Charles I.--Morganitic Marriage--
      Lord Bacon's Palace and Gardens--"Dies
      Iræ, Dies Illa"--Aubrey Family--Ogden Family         70

    Sir George Buc, by E. F. Rimbault and Cecil Monro      73
    "A frog he would a-wooing go"                          74
    Replies to Minor Queries;--Carucate of Land--
      Golden Frog and Sir John Poley--The Poley Frog--
      Bands--Bishops and their Precedence--"Imprest"
      and "Debenture"--Charade--"Laus tua, non tua
      Fraus"--Dutch Language--"Construe" and "translate"--
      Dutton Family--Mother of Thomas à Becket--
      Medal of Stukeley--Dulcarnon--Practice of Scalping--
      Derivation of Penny                                  75

    "By Hook or by Crook"--Burning dead Bodies--
      Etymology of "Barbarian"--Royal and distinguished
      Disinterments                                        78

    Notes on Books, Sales, Catalogues, Sales, &c.          79
    Books and Odd Volumes Wanted                           79
    Notices to Correspondents                              79
    Advertisements                                         79

       *       *       *       *       *



G.'s inquiry (Vol. i., p. 22.) about the two Gorings of the Civil War--a
period of our history in which I am much interested--has led me to look
into some of the sources of original information for that time, in the hope
that I might be enabled to answer his Queries. I regret I cannot yet answer
his precise questions, when Lord Goring the son was married, and when and
where he died? but I think the following references to notices of the
father and the son will be acceptable to him; and I venture to think that
the working out in this way of neglected biographies, is one of the many
uses to which your excellent periodical may be applied.

Confusion has undoubtedly been made between the father and son by careless
compilers. But whoever carefully reads the passages of contemporary writers
relating to the two Gorings, and keeps in mind that the title of Earl of
Norwich, given by Charles I. in November, 1644, to the father, was not
recognised by the parliamentary party, will have no difficulty in
distinguishing between the two. Thus it will be seen in two of the passages
which I subjoin from Carte's _Letters_, that in 1649 a parliamentarian
calls the father Lord Goring, and Sir Edward Nicholas calls him Earl of

Burke, in his _Dormant and Extinct Peerages_, vol. iii., makes the mistake
of giving to the father the son's proceedings at Portsmouth at the
beginning of the Civil War.

Lord Goring the son, then Colonel Goring, commanding a regiment in the Low
Countries, was, at the siege of Breda, September, 1637, severely wounded in
the leg, and had a narrow escape of losing it. Sir William Boswell, the
English ambassador at the Hague, writes to Bramhall, then Bishop of Derry,
and afterwards Archbishop of Armagh:--

    "Colonel Goring having the guard of the English in the approaches, was
    shot so dangerously cross the shin of his leg, a little above his
    ankle, as the chirurgion at first resolved to cut off his leg to save
    his life; but upon second thoughts, and some opposition by one of them
    against four, they forebare; and now, thanks be to God, he is gotten
    out of danger of losing life or leg this bout: his excellent merits
    caused a great sorrow at his misfortune, and now as great comfort in
    the hope of his recovery"--(_Rawdon Papers_, p. 39.)

That the son was already married to Lady Letitia Boyle at Christmas, 1641,
appears from a letter of the Earl of Cork, the lady's father, to the Earl
of Norwich (at that time Lord Goring), in Lord Orrery's _State Letters_
(vol. i. p. 5. Dublin edition):--

    "I have scarce time to present my service to you and your lady, and to
    George and my poor Letitia, whom God bless."

In Carte's _Collection of Letters_ (vol. i. p. 359.) {66} is a letter from
Lord Byron, dated "Beauvois, March 1-11, 1650," to the Marquis of Ormond,
stating that Lord Goring the son has come to Beauvois, and is on his way to
Spain, about the settlement of a pension which had been promised him there,
and also to endeavour to get arms and money for the King's service in
Ireland; and that, having settled his business in Spain, he desires nothing
better than to serve as a volunteer under Ormond for King Charles. Lord
Byron strongly recommends Ormond to avail himself of Goring's services:--

    "I am confident my Lord Goring may be serviceable to your Excellence in
    many respects, and therefore have rather encouraged him in this his
    resolution, than any ways dehorted him from it; and especially because
    he is to pass by the Spanish Court, where he hath such habitudes, by
    reason of the service both his father and he hath done that crown."

In an intercepted letter of a parliamentarian, dated Jan. 8, 1649, which is
in Carte's _Letters_ (vol. i. p. 201.), is the following mention of the
Earl of Norwich, then under sentence of death by the High Court of

    "Our great minds say, Thursday the King shall die, and two or three
    great Lords with him, Capel and Loughborough being two of them. Goring
    hath gotten Ireton to friend, who excuses him yet."

Sir E. Nicholas writes, April 8, 1649, to the Marquis of Ormond, that the
Earl of Norwich (as he styles him) has been reprieved at the suit of the
Spanish and Dutch ambassadors. (Carte's _Letters_, vol. i. p. 247.)

In the following passage of a speech, in the discussions about the House of
Lords in Richard Cromwell's Parliament, there is no doubt that the Earl of
Norwich is referred to as Lord Goring: and I should infer that George Lord
Goring the son was then dead, as he had unquestionably done more than
enough to forfeit his privileges in the view of Commonwealth men:--

    "What hath the son of Lord Goring or Lord Capel done to forfeit their
    right?"--(Burton's _Diary_, iii. 421. Feb. 22. 1659.)

George Lord Goring the son is referred to in another speech preserved in
Burton's _Diary_, and is there called "young Lord Goring." (iii. 206.)

Pepys mentions the return of "Lord Goring" from France, April 11, 1660
(vol. i. p. 54.). Lord Braybrooke's note says that this was "Charles, who
succeeded his father as second Earl of Norwich." Is it certain that this
was not the old Earl of Norwich himself?

The death of the old Earl of Norwich is thus chronicled in Peck's
_Desiderata Curiosa_, p. 542.:--

    "Jan. 6. 1662-3, died Lord Goring on his passage by land from Hampton
    Court to London, at Brainford, about eighty years of age: he was Earl
    of Norwich."


       *       *       *       *       *


A "Note" in the _Original Letters_ relative to the English Reformation,
published by the Parker Society, p. 91., mentions the existence of an
important MS. treatise by Bishop Ridley, which had been unknown when the
works of that prelate were collected and published by the Parker Society in
1841. It seems to be desirable that the fact should be placed on record in
your most useful publication: the "Note" is as follows:--

    "A copy of Bishop Ridley's 'Conference by writing with M. Hoper,
    exhibited up to the council in the time of King Edward the Sixth,' was
    in the possession of Archbishop Whitgift: see his _Defence of the
    Answer to the Admonition_, A.D. 1574, p. 25. But its existence was
    unknown (see _Ridley's Life of Bishop Ridley_, Lond. 1763, p. 315.) in
    later years, till a copy, slightly imperfect, was discovered in 1844,
    in the extensive collection of MSS. belonging to Sir Thomas Phillips,

There is another MS. treatise by Bishop Ridley, that has been missing for
nearly three centuries, respecting which I should be glad to offer a
"Query:" I allude to Ridley's _Treatise on Election and Predestination_.
The evidence that such a piece ever existed is, that Ridley, in answer both
to a communication from prison, signed by Bishop Ferrar, Rowland Taylor,
John Bradford, and Archdeacon Philpot, and probably to other letters from
Bradford, wrote,--

    "Where you say that, if your request had been heard, things, you think,
    had been in better case than they be, know you that, concerning the
    matter you mean, I have in Latin drawn out the places of the
    Scriptures, and upon the same have noted what I can for the time. Sir,
    in those matters I am so fearful, that I dare not speak further, yea,
    almost none otherwise, than the very text doth, as it were, lead me by
    the hand."--_Works of Bishop Ridley_, Parker Soc., p. 368.

And to this statement Bishop Coverdale, in the _Letters of the Martyrs_,
Day, 1564, p. 65., caused the following side-note to be printed:--

    "He meaneth here the matter of God's election, whereof he afterward
    wrote a godly and comfortable treatise, remaining yet in the hands of
    some, and hereafter shall come to light, if God so will."

Glocester Ridley, in his _Life of Bishop Ridley_, 1763, p. 554, states:--

    "I never heard that it was published, nor have I been able to meet with
    it in MS. The great learning and cool judgment of this prelate, and the
    entire subjection of his imagination to the revealed will of God, make
    the loss of this treatise much to be lamented."

Could any of your correspondents offer any suggestion, or supply any
information, which might throw light on the subject, or might give a clue
to the lost manuscript? The treatise referred to {67} might possibly still
exist, and, even if without Ridley's name, or in an imperfect state, might
yet be identified, either from the handwriting or some other circumstance.
Do any of your correspondents possess or know of any MS. on Election or
Free-will, of the time of the Reformation, which might possibly be the
missing treatise? Things turn up so curiously, in quarters where one would
least expect it, and sometimes after more than three centuries, that one
would willingly hope that this lost treatise might even yet be found or



       *       *       *       *       *


The accompanying is from the pen of one of the officers who bore a
prominent position in one of the expeditions under Sir Edward Parry in
search of a north-west passage. Not having been in print, except in private
circulation, it may be deemed worthy of a place in your valuable journal.



 "The moments of chasten'd delight are gone by,
  When we left our lov'd homes o'er new regions to rove,
  When the firm manly grasp, and the soft female sigh,
  Mark'd the mingled sensations of friendship and love.
  That season of pleasure has hurried away,
  When through far-stretching ice a safe passage we found[1],
  That led us again to the dark rolling sea,
  And the signal was seen, 'On for Lancaster's Sound.'[2]

 "The joys that were felt when we pass'd by the shore
  Where no footsteps of Man had e'er yet been imprest,
  When rose in the distance no mountain-tops hoar
  As the sun of the ev'ning bright gilded the west,
  Full swiftly they fled--and that hour, too, is gone
  When we gain'd the meridian, assign'd as a bound
  To entitle our crews to their country's first boon,
  Hail'd by all as an omen _the passage_ was found.

 "And pass'd with our pleasures are moments of pain,
  Of anxious suspense, and of eager alarm.
  Environ'd by ice, skill and ardour were vain
  The swift moving mass of its force to disarm--
  Yet, dash'd on the beach and our boats torn away,
  No anchors could hold us, nor cables secure;
  The dread and the peril expir'd with the day,
  When none but High Heaven could our safety ensure.

 "Involv'd with the ages existent before,
  Is the year that has brought us thus far on our way,
  And gratitude calls us our God to adore,
  For the oft-renewed mercies its annals display.
  The gloomy meridian of darkness is past,
  And ere long shall gay spring bid the herbage revive;
  On the wide waste of ice she'll re-echo the blast,
  And the firm prison'd ocean its fetters shall rive.


[Footnote 1: Alluding to the ships crossing the barrier of ice in Baffin's
Bay, between Hope Sanderson and Possession Bay.]

[Footnote 2: Telegraph signal made by H.M.S. "Hecla," on getting into clear
water in July, 1849, having succeeded in forcing through the barrier.]

       *       *       *       *       *


_Legend of Sir Richard Baker, surnamed Bloody Baker_.--I one day was
looking over the different monuments in Cranbrook Church in Kent, when in
the chancel my attention was arrested by one erected to the memory of Sir
Richard Baker. The gauntlet, gloves, helmet, and spurs were (as is often
the case in monumental erections of Elizabethan date) suspended over the
tomb. What chiefly attracted my attention was the colour of the gloves,
which was red. The old woman who acted as my cicerone, seeing me look at
them, said, "Aye, miss, those are Bloody Baker's gloves; their red colour
comes from the blood he shed." This speech awakened my curiosity to hear
more, and with very little pressing I induced my old guide to tell me the
following strange tale.

The Baker family had formerly large possessions in Cranbrook, but in the
reign of Edward VI. great misfortunes fell on them; by extravagance and
dissipation, they gradually lost all their lands, until an old house in the
village (now used as the poor-house) was all that remained to them. The
sole representative of the family remaining at the accession of Queen Mary,
was Sir Richard Baker. He had spent some years abroad in consequence of a
duel; but when, said my informant, Bloody Queen Mary reigned, he thought he
might safely return, as he was a Papist. When he came to Cranbrook he took
up his abode in his old house; he only brought one foreign servant with
him, and these two lived alone. Very soon strange stories began to be
whispered respecting unearthly shrieks having been heard frequently to
issue at nightfall from his house. Many people of importance were stopped
and robbed in the Glastonbury woods, and many unfortunate travellers were
missed and never heard of more. Richard Baker still continued to live in
seclusion, but he gradually repurchased his alienated property, although he
was known to have spent all he possessed before he left England. But
wickedness was not always to prosper. He formed an apparent attachment to a
young lady in the neighbourhood, remarkable for always wearing a great many
jewels. He often pressed her to come and see his old house, telling her he
had many curious things he wished to show her. She had always resisted
fixing a day for her visit, but happening to walk within a short distance
of his house, she determined to surprise him with a visit; her companion, a
lady older than herself, endeavoured to dissuade her from doing so, but she
would not be turned from her purpose. They {68} knocked at the door, but no
one answered them; they, however, discovered it was not locked, and
determined to enter. At the head of the stairs hung a parrot, which on
their passing cried out,--

 "Peepoh, pretty lady, be not too bold,
  Or your red blood will soon run cold."

And cold did run the blood of the adventurous damsel when, on opening one
of the room doors, she found it filled with the dead bodies of murdered
persons, chiefly women. Just then they heard a noise, and on looking out of
the window saw Bloody Baker and his servant bringing in the murdered body
of a lady. Nearly dead with fear, they concealed themselves in a recess
under the staircase.

As the murderers with their dead burden passed by them, the hand of the
unfortunate murdered lady hung in the baluster of the stairs; with an oath
Bloody Baker chopped it off, and it fell into the lap of one of the
concealed ladies. As soon as the murderers had passed by, the ladies ran
away, having the presence of mind to carry with them the dead hand, on one
of the fingers of which was a ring. On reaching home they told their story,
and in confirmation of it displayed the ring. All the families who had lost
relatives mysteriously were then told of what had been found out; and they
determined to ask Baker to a large party, apparently in a friendly manner,
but to have constables concealed ready to take him into custody. He came,
suspecting nothing, and then the lady told him all she had seen, pretending
it was a dream. "Fair lady," said he, "dreams are nothing: they are but
fables." "They may be fables," said she; "but is this a fable?" and she
produced the hand and ring. Upon this the constables rushed in and took
him; and the tradition further says, he was burnt, notwithstanding Queen
Mary tried to save him, on account of the religion he professed.

F. L.

_Cure for Warts._--Steal a piece of meat from a butcher's stall or his
basket, and after having well rubbed the parts affected with the stolen
morsel, bury it under a gateway, at a four lane ends, or, in case of
emergency, in any secluded place. All this must be done so secretly as to
escape detection: and as the portion of meat decays the warts will
disappear. This practice is very prevalent in Lancashire and some parts of
Yorkshire; and two of my female acquaintances having _tried_ the remedy,
stoutly maintain its efficacy.

T. T. W.


_Another Charm for Warts._--Referring to EMDEE'S charm for warts, which
appeared in Vol. ii., p. 19., I may state that a very similar superstition
prevails in the neighbourhood of Manchester:--Take a piece of twine, making
upon it as many knots as there are warts to be removed; touch each wart
with the corresponding knot; and bury the twine in a moist place, saying at
the same time, "There is none to redeem it besides thee." As the process of
decay goes on, the warts gradually disappear.


_Charm for the Cure of the King's Evil._--Acting on the advice of your able
correspondent EMDEE (Vol. i., p. 429.), I beg to forward the following
curious and cruel charm for the cure of the king's evil, extracted from a
very quaint old work by William Ellis, farmer of Little Gaddesden, near
Hempstead, Herts, published at Salisbury in 1750:--

    "A girl at Gaddesden, having the evil in her Feet from her Infancy, at
    eleven years old lost one of her toes by it, and was so bad that she
    could hardly walk, therefore was to be sent to a London Hospital in a
    little time. But a Beggar woman coming to the Door and hearing of it,
    said, that if they would cut off the hind leg, and the fore leg on the
    contrary side of that, of a toad, and she wear them in a silken bag
    about her neck, it would certainly cure her; but it was to be observed,
    that on the toad's losing its legs, it was to be turned loose abroad,
    and as it pined, wasted, and died, the distemper would likewise waste
    and die; which happened accordingly, for the girl was entirely cured by
    it, never having had the evil afterwards. Another Gaddesden girl having
    the evil in her eyes, her parents dried a toad in the sun, and put it
    in a silken bag, which they hung on the back part of her neck; and
    although it was thus dried, it drawed so much as to raise little
    blisters, but did the girl a great deal of service, till she carelessly
    lost it."



_Fig-Sunday._--One of my Sunday-school boys, in reply to my question "What
particular name was there for the Sunday before Easter?" answered

Can you give any authentic information as to the origin of this name? It
most probably alludes to our Saviour's desire to eat fruit of the fig-tree
on his way from Bethany on the _Monday_ following.

Hone mentions that at a village in Hertfordshire, more figs are sold in
that week than at any other period of the year; but assigns no reason for
the custom. If you have met with any satisfactory explanation of this name,
I shall feel obliged by your making it public.

B. D.

       *       *       *       *       *


Butler, in his description of Hudibras, says (Part I. c. i. line 453.) that
the knight

         "----wore but one Spur,
  As wisely knowing, cou'd he stir
  To active Foot one side of 's Horse,
  The other wou'd not hang an A----."

Gray, the most copious annotator on the poem, passes these lines in
silence; and it is probable, therefore, that the description is taken by
readers {69} in general as an original sketch. I find, however, in a volume
entitled _Gratiæ Ludentes: Jests from the Universitie_, by H. L., Oxen.
[sic], London, 1638, the following, which may have been in Butler's mind:--

     "_One that wore but one Spurre._

    "A scholler being jeer'd on the way for wearing but one Spurre, said,
    that if one side of his horse went on, it was not likely that the other
    would stay behinde."

As compilers of jest-books do nothing but copy from their predecessors, it
is likely that this joke may be found elsewhere, though I have not met with
it in any other collection. At all events, the date of the vol. from which
I quote is in favour of Butler's intimacy with its contents; and as it is
interesting, even in so trivial a matter, to trace the resources of our
popular authors, you may perhaps think it worth while to include the above
in a number of the "NOTES."


       *       *       *       *       *


The idea has been suggested in the "NOTES AND QUERIES," but I do not know
how to refer to the places[3], or recollect what authorities were given.
Probably that of Howell was not, as it occurs in a very scarce volume; and,
on the chance of its not having been met with by your readers, I send it.
It is contained in a letter addressed "To his highly esteemed Friend and
Compatriot, Judge Rumsey, upon his _Provang_, or rare pectorall Instrument,
and his rare experiments of Cophie and Tobacco." This letter is prefixed to
the learned Judge's _Organon Salutis: an Instrument to cleanse the Stomach,
as also divers New Experiments of the Virtue of Tobacco and Coffee, &c._
London, 1657, 8vo.

Howell says:--

    "Touching coffee, I concurre with them in opinion, who hold it to be
    that black-broth which was us'd of old in Lacedemon, whereof the Poets
    sing; Surely it must needs be salutiferous, because so many sagacious,
    and the wittiest sort of Nations use it so much; as they who have
    conversed with Shashes and Turbants doe well know. But, besides the
    exsiccant quality it hath to dry up the crudities of the Stomach, as
    also to comfort the Brain, to fortifie the sight with its steem, and
    prevent Dropsies, Gouts, the Scurvie, together with the Spleen and
    Hypocondriacall windes (all which it doth without any violence or
    distemper at all), I say, besides all these qualities, 'tis found
    already, that this Coffee-drink hath caused a greater sobriety among
    the nations: For whereas formerly Apprentices and Clerks with others,
    used to take their mornings' draught in Ale, Beer, or Wine, which by
    the dizziness they cause in the Brain, make many unfit for businesse,
    they use now to play the Good-fellows in this wakefull and civill
    drink: Therefore that worthy Gentleman, Mr. Mudiford, who introduced
    the practice hereof first to London, deserves much respect of the whole

Of Judge Rumsey and his _Provang_ (which was a flexible whalebone from two
to three feet long, with a small linen or silk button at the end, which was
to be introduced into the stomach to produce the effect of an emetic), the
reader may find some account in Wood's _Athen_. (Bliss's edit., vol. iii.
p. 509.), and this is not the place to speak of them except as they had to
do with coffee; on that point a few more words may be allowed.

Besides the letter of Howell already quoted, two others are prefixed to the
book; one from the author to Sir Henry Blount, the other Sir Henry's reply.
In the former the Judge says,--

    "I lately understood that your discovery, in your excellent book of
    travels, hath brought the use of the Turkes Physick, of Cophie, in
    great request in England, whereof I have made use, in another form than
    is used by boyling of it in Turkie, and being less loathsome and
    troublesome," &c.

And Sir Henry, after a fervent panegyric on coffee, replies:--

    "As for your way of taking both Cophie and Tobacco, the rarity of the
    invention consists in leaving the old way: For the water of the one and
    the smoke of the other may be of inconvenience to many; but your way in
    both takes in the virtue of the Simples without any additionall

As this may excite the reader's curiosity to know what was the Judge's new
and superior "way" of using coffee, I will add his prescription for making
"electuary of cophy," which is, I believe, the only preparation of it which
he used or recommended:--

    "Take equall quantity of Butter and Sallet-oyle, melt them well
    together, but not boyle them: Then stirre them well that they may
    incorporate together: Then melt therewith three times as much Honey,
    and stirre it well together: Then add thereunto Powder of Turkish
    Cophie, to make it a thick Electuary." p. 5.

A very little consideration may convince one that this electuary was likely
to effect the purpose for which it was recommended.

    "Whether," says the Judge, "it be in time of health or sickness,
    whensoever you find any evill disposition in the stomach, eat a
    convenient meal of what meat and drink you please, then walk a little
    while after it: Then set down your body bending, and thrust the said
    Whalebone Instrument into your stomach, stirring it very gently, which
    will make you vomit; then drink a good draught of drink, and so use the
    Instrument as oft as you please, but never doe this upon an empty
    stomach. To make the stomach more apt to vomit, and to prepare the
    humours thereunto before you eat and drink, Take the bigness of a
    Nutmeg or more of the said Electuary of Cophie, &c., into your mouth;
    {70} then take drink to drive it down; then eat and drink, and walk,
    and use the Instrument as before." p. 19.

Should any reader wish to test the efficacy of the learned Judge's
prescription, I am afraid he must make an "instrument" for himself, or get
one made for him; though when the _Organon Salutis_ was published, they
were "commonly sold in London, and especially at the long shops in
Westminster Hall."

As to the book, and the name of the author, I may add (with reference to
Wood's _Athen._), that in the copy before me, which is, like that referred
to by Dr. Bliss, of the first edition (not the second mentioned by Aubrey
as published in 1659), the author's name does not appear on the
_title-page_ at all. There we find only "By W. R. of Gray's Inne, Esq.
Experto credo" [sic]; and really one seems as if one could believe any
thing from a man who had habitually used such medicines, for I have said
nothing of his infusion of tobacco, for which you must--

    "Take a quarter of a pound of Tobacco, and a quart of Ale, White-wine,
    or Sider, and three or four spoonfulls of Hony, and two pennyworth of
    Mace; And infuse these by a soft fire, in a close earthen pot, to the
    consumption of almost the one-half, and then you may take from two
    spoonfulls to twelve [no tea-spoons in those days], and drink it in a
    cup with Ale or Beer."

One could, I say, believe almost any thing from a gentleman who under such
a course of discipline was approaching the age of fourscore; but though the
title-page has only his initials, the Dedication to the Marquess of
Dorchester, and the letter to Sir Henry Blount, are both signed "Will.

S. R. M.

[Footnote 3: See Vol. i. pp. 124. 139. 156. 242. 300. and 399.]

       *       *       *       *       *



I am very desirous of gaining some knowledge respecting the following MSS.,
especially as regards their locality at the present time. Perhaps some of
your numerous readers can help me to the information which I seek.

1. "Whitelocke's Labours remembered in the Annales of his Life, written for
the use of his Children." This valuable MS. contains a most minute and
curious account of the performance of Shirley's masque, entitled _The
Triumphs of Peace_. In 1789, when Dr. Burney published the third volume of
his _History of Music_, it was in the possession of Dr. Morton of the
British Museum.--Query, Was Dr. Morton's library disposed of by auction, or
what was its destiny?

2. "A MS. Treatise on the Art of Illumination, written in the year 1525."
This MS. is said by Edward Rowe Mores, in his _Dissertation upon English
Typographical Founders_, to have been in the possession of Humphrey Wanley,
who by its help "refreshed the injured or decayed illuminations in the
library of the Earl of Oxford." The MS. was transcribed by Miss Elstob in
1710, and a copy of her transcript was in the possession of Mr. George
Ballard. Where now is the original?

3. "A Memorandum-book in the handwriting of Paul Bowes, Esq., son of Sir
Thomas Bowes, of London, and of Bromley Hall, Essex, Knight, and dated
1673." In 1783 this MS., which contains some highly interesting and
important information, was in the possession of a gentleman named Broke, of
Nacton in Suffolk, a descendant from the Bowes family; but I have not been
able to trace it further.

4. "The Negotiations of Thomas Wolsey, Cardinall." This valuable MS. was in
the collection of Dr. Farmer, who wrote on the fly-leaf,--

    "I believe several of the Letters and State Papers in this volume have
    not been published; three or four are printed in the collections at the
    end of Dr. Fiddes' _Life of Wolsey_, from a MS. in the Yelverton

If I remember rightly, the late Richard Heber afterwards came into the
possession of this curious and important volume. It is lamentable to think
of the dispersion of poor Heber's manuscripts.


       *       *       *       *       *

Minor Queries.

_Chantrey's Sleeping Children in Lichfield Cathedral._--In reference to a
claim recently put forth on behalf of an individual to the merit of having
designed and executed this celebrated monument, Mr. Peter Cunningham says
(_Literary Gazette_, June 5.),--"The merit of the composition belongs to
Chantrey and Stothard." As a regular reader of the "NOTES AND QUERIES," I
shall feel obliged to Mr. Cunningham (whose name I am always glad to see as
a correspondent) if he will be kind enough to inform me on what evidence he
founds the title of Mr. Stothard to a share of the merit of a piece of
sculpture, which is so generally attributed to the genius of Chantrey?


_Viscount Dundee's Ring._--In the _Letters of John Grahame of Claverhouse,
Viscount of Dundee_, printed for the Bannatyne Club in 1826, is a
description and engraving of a ring containing some of Ld. Dundee's hair,
with the letters V.D., surmounted by a coronet, worked on it in gold; and
on the inside of the ring are engraved a skull, and the posey--"Great
Dundee, for God and me, J. Rex."

The ring, which belonged to the family of Graham of Duntrune
(representative of Viscount Dundee), has for several years been lost or
mislaid; perhaps, through some of the numerous readers of the "NOTES AND
QUERIES," information {71} might be obtained as to the place where that
ring is at present preserved, and whether there would be any possibility of
the family recovering it by purchase or otherwise.


Duntrune, near Dundee.

_The Kilkenny Cats._--I would feel obliged if any of your correspondents
could give me information as to the first, or any early, published allusion
to the strange tale, modernly become proverbial, of the ferocity of the
cats of Kilkenny. The story generally told is, that two of those animals
fought in a sawpit with such ferocious determination that when the battle
was over nothing could be found remaining of either combatant except _his
tail_,--the marvellous inference to be drawn therefrom being, of course,
that they had devoured each other. This ludicrous anecdote has, no doubt,
been generally looked upon as an absurdity of the Joe Miller class; but
this I conceive to be a mistake. I have not the least doubt that the story
of the mutual destruction of the contending cats was an allegory designed
to typify the utter ruin to which centuries of litigation and embroilment
on the subject of conflicting rights and privileges tended to reduce the
respective exchequers of the rival municipal bodies of Kilkenny and
Irishtown,--separate corporations existing within the liberties of one
city, and the boundaries of whose respective jurisdiction had never been
marked out or defined by an authority to which either was willing to bow.
Their struggles for precedency, and for the maintenance of alleged rights
invaded, commenced A.D. 1377. (see _Rot. Claus._ 51 Ed. III. 76.), and were
carried on with truly feline fierceness and implacability till the end of
the seventeenth century, when it may fairly be considered that they had
mutually devoured each other to the very _tail_, as we find their property
all mortgaged, and see them each passing by-laws that their respective
officers should be content with the dignity of their station, and forego
all hope of salary till the suit at law with the other "pretended
corporation" should be terminated, and the incumbrances thereby caused
removed with the vanquishment of the enemy. Those who have taken the story
of the Kilkenny cats in its literal sense have done grievous injustice to
the character of the grimalkins of the "faire cittie," who are really quite
as demure and quietly disposed a race of tabbies as it is in the nature of
any such animals to be.



_Robert de Welle._--Can any of your correspondents inform me of what family
was Robert de Welle, who married Matilda, one of the co-heirs of Thomas de
Clare, and in 15th Edward II. received seisin of possessions in Ireland,
and a mediety of the Seneschalship of the Forest of Essex in her right?
(_Rotul. Original., Record Commission_, pp. 266, 277.) And how came the
Irish title of Baron Welles into the family of Knox?

Again, where can I meet with a song called the Derby Ram, very popular in
my school-boy days, but of which I recollect only one stanza,--

 "The man that killed the ram, Sir,
    Was up to his knees in blood;
  The boy that held the bucket, Sir,
    Was carried away in the flood."

I fancy it had an electioneering origin.

H. W.

_Lady Slingsby._--Among many of the plays temp. Car. II. the name of "The
Lady Slingsby" occurs in the list of performers composing the _dramatis
personæ_. Who was this Lady Slingsby?


_God save the Queen._--Can any correspondent state the reason of the recent
discontinuance of this brief but solemn and scriptural ejaculation, at the
close of royal proclamations, letters, &c., read during the service of the

J. H. M.

_Meaning of Steyne--Origin of Adur._--Can any of your correspondents give
the derivation of the word "Steyne," as used at Brighton, for instance? or
the origin of the name "Adur," a small river running into the sea at


_Col. Lilburn._--Who was the author of a book called _Lieut.-Colonel John
Lilburn tryed and cast, or his Case and Craft discovered, &c., &c._,
published by authority, 1653?

P. S. W. E.

_French Verses._--Will one of your readers kindly inform me from what
French poet the two following stanzas are taken?

 "La Mort a des rigueurs à nulle autre pareilles.
    On a beau la prier,
  La cruelle, qu'elle est, se bouche les oreilles,
    Et nous laisse crier.

 "Le pauvre en sa cabane, que le chaume couvre,
    Est sujet à ses lois;
  Et la garde qui veille aux barrières du Louvre
    N'en défend pas les rois."

E. R. C. B.

_Our World._--I once heard a lady repeat the following pithy lines, and
shall be glad if any of your readers can tell me who is the author, and
where they first appeared,

 "'Tis a very good world to live in--
  To lend, and to spend, and to give in;
  But to beg, or to borrow, or ask for one's own,
 'Tis the very worst world that ever was known."

D. V. S.

Home, April 29.

_Porson's Imposition._--When Porson was at Cambridge, his tutor lent him a
pound to buy books, which he spent in getting drunk at a {72} tavern. The
tutor set him an imposition, which he made to consist in a dog-Greek poem,
giving an account of the affair. These were the three first lines,--

  [Greek: "Tutor emoi men poundon elendeto; ôs mala simplos]
  [Greek: Ton men egô spendon kata dômata redlionoio,]
  [Greek: Drinkomenos kai rhôromenos dia nukta bebaiôs."]

Then part of another,--

  [Greek: "--autar egô megalois klubboisin ebanchthên."]

I cannot but think that some Cambridge men know the whole, which would be
invaluable to retrieve. There is nothing about it in Kidd.

C. B.

_Alice Rolle._--Can any of your readers conversant with Irish pedigrees, if
they remember to have met with this lady's name, kindly inform me where it
may be found?

S. S. S.

_The Meaning of "Race" in Ship-building._--In Hawkin's _Voyages_ ("Hakluyt
Society, 1847"), p. 199., he says, "Here is offerred to speak of a point
much canvassed amongst carpenters and sea-captains, diversely maintained
but yet undetermined, that is, whether the _race_, or loftie built shippe,
bee best for the merchant;" and again, p. 219.: "A third and last cause of
the losse of sundry of our men, most worthy of note for all captains,
owners, and carpenters, was the _race_ building of our ship, the onely
fault she had," &c. Can any of your correspondents explain what is meant by
"race"; the editor of the _Voyages_, Captain C. R. D. Bethune, R.N.,
confesses himself unable to explain it.

E. N. W.

Southwark, May 27. 1850.

_The Battle of Death._--I possess a curious old print entitled "The Battle
of Death against all Creatures, and the Desolation wrought by Time." It
bears the engraver's name, "Robert Smith," but no date. The figures,
however, which are numerous, and comprise all ranks, seem to present the
costume of the latter end of the 16th century. There is a long inscription
in verse, and another in prose: query, who was the author of the verses,
and what is the date of the engraving? As I am on the subject of prints,
perhaps some person learned in such matters will also be kind enough to
inform me what number constitutes a complete series of the engravings after
Claude by Francis Vivares; and who was "Jean Rocque, Chirographaire du
Roi," who executed several maps of portions of London, also a map of

X. Y. A.

Kilkenny, June 8. 1850.

_Execution of Charles I._--Is the name of the executioner known who
beheaded King Charles I.? Is there any truth in the report that it was an
Earl Stair?

P. S. W. E.

_Morganitic Marriage._--In Ducange, &c., the adjective _morganitic_ is
connected with the _morgangab_ (morning gift), which was usual from a
husband to his wife the day after their marriage. How comes this adjective
to be applied to marriages in which the wife does not take her husband's


_Lord Bacon's Palace and Gardens._--Will any of your architectural or
landscape gardening readers inform me whether any attempts were ever made
by any of our English sovereigns or nobility, or by any of our rich men of
science and taste, to carry out, in practice, Lord Bacon's plans of _a
princely palace_, or _a prince-like garden_, as so graphically and so
beautifully described in his _Essays_, xlv. and xlvi., "Of Building" and
"Of Gardens"?

I cannot but think that if such an attempt was never made, the failure is
discreditable to us as a nation; and that this work ought yet to be
executed, as well for its own intrinsic beauty and excellence, as in honour
of the name and fame of its great proposer.


June 24. 1850.

_"Dies Iræ, Dies Illa."_--Will any of your correspondents oblige me by
answering the following Queries. Who was the author of the extremely
beautiful hymn, commencing--

 "Dies iræ, dies illa,
  Solvet soeclum in favilla
  Teste David cum Sibylla."

And in what book was it first printed?

A copy of it is contained in a small tract in our library, entitled _Lyrica
Sacra, excerpta ex Hymnis Ecclesiæ Antiquis. Privatim excusa Romæ_, 1818.
At the end of the preface is subscribed "T. M. Anglus." And on the title
page in MS., "For the Rev. Dr. Milner, Dean of Carlisle, Master of Queen's
College, in the University of Cambridge, from T. J. Mathia--" the rest of
the name has been cut off in binding; it was probably Mathias. As here
given, it has only twenty-seven lines. The original hymn is, I believe,
much longer.


Queen's College, Cambridge.

_Aubrey Family._--In Burke's _Peerage and Baronetage_, under the head
"Aubrey," I find the following passage:--

    "Vincent, Windsor Herald in the time of Elizabeth, compiled a pedigree
    of the family of Aubrey, which he commences thus:--'Saint Aubrey, of
    the blood royal of France, came into England with William the
    Conqueror, anno 1066, as the Chronicles of All Souls College testify,
    which are there to be seen tied to a chain of iron.'"

Can any of your readers give me any information respecting this "Saint
Aubrey," whose name I have not been able to find in the Roll of Battle {73}
Abbey: or respecting his son, Sir Reginald Aubrey, who aided Bernard de
Newmarch in the conquest of the Marches of Wales, and any of his


_Ogden Family._--The writer is very desirous of information as to the past
history of a family of the name of _Ogden_. Dr. Samuel Ogden, the author of
a volume of sermons, published in 1760, was a member of it. A branch of the
family emigrated to America about 1700, and still exists there. They yet
bear in their crest allusion to a tradition, that one of their family hid
Charles II. in an oak, when pursued by his enemies. What authority is there
for this story? I shall be grateful for any indications of sources of
information that may seem likely to aid my researches.


       *       *       *       *       *



It has often been noticed, that when a writer wishes to support some
favourite hypothesis, he quite overlooks many important particulars that
militate against his own view of the case. The Rev. Mr. Corser, in his
valuable communication respecting Sir George Buc (Vol. ii., p. 38.), is not
exempt from this accusation. He has omitted the statement of Malone, that
"Sir George Buc died on the 28th of September, 1623." (Boswell's
_Shakspeare_, iii. 59.) We know _positively_ that in May 1622, Sir George,
"by reason of sickness and indisposition of body, wherewith it hath pleased
God to visit him, was become disabled and insufficient to undergo and
perform" the duties of Master of the Revels; and it is equally _positive_
that Malone would not so circumstantially have said, "Sir George Buc _died_
on the 28th of September, 1623," without some good authority for so doing.
It is only to be regretted that the learned commentator neglected to give
that authority.

Mr. Corser wishes to show that Sir George Buc's days "were further
prolonged till 1660;" but I think he is in error as to his conclusions, and
that _another_ George Buc must enter the field and divide the honours with
his knightly namesake.

It is perfectly clear that a George Buc was living long after the date
assigned as that of the death of Sir George, by Malone. This George _Buck_,
for so he invariably spells his name, contributed a copy of verses to
Yorke's _Union of Honour_, 1640; to Shirley's _Poems_, 1646; and to the
folio edition of Beaumont and Fletcher's _Plays_, 1647. Ritson, then, when
speaking of Sir George Buc's _Great Plantagenet_, as published in 1635, was
rather hasty in pronouncing it as the work of "some fellow who assumed his
name," because here is evidence that a person of the same name (if not Sir
George himself, as Mr. Corser thinks) was living at the period. The name,
if _assumed_ in the case of the _Great Plantagenet_, would hardly have been
kept up in the publications just alluded to.

In the British Museum, among the Cotton MSS. (_Tiberius_, E. X.), is
preserved a MS. called "The history of King Richard the Third, comprised in
five books, gathered and written by Sir G. Buc, Knight, Master of the
King's Office of the Revels, and one of the gentlemen of his Majesty's
Privy Chamber." This MS., which appears to have been the author's rough
draft, is corrected by interlineations and erasements in every page. It is
much injured by fire, but a part of the dedication to Sir Thomas Howard,
the Earl of Arundel, &c., still remains, together with "an advertisement to
the reader," which is dated "from the King's Office of the Revels, St.
Peter's Hill, 1619." This _history_ was first published in 1646, by George
Buck, _Esquire_, who says, in his dedication to Philip, the Earl of
Pembroke and Montgomery, "that he had _collected these papers out of their
dust_." Here is evidence that the work was not _published_ by the original
compiler; besides, how can Mr. Corser reconcile his author's knighthood
with the designations on the respective title-pages of _The Great
Plantagenet_, and _The History of Richard the Third_? In the former the
writer is styled "George Buck, _Esquire_," and in the latter, "George Buck,
_Gentleman_." It is difficult to account for Mr. Corser's omission of these
facts, because I am well assured, that, with his extensive knowledge of our
earlier poets, my information is not new to him.

That there were _two_ George Bucs in the seventeenth century, and both of
them poets, cannot, I think, be doubted. Perhaps they were not even
relations; at any rate, Mr. Corser's account of the parentage of _one_
differs from mine entirely.

    "He [Sir George Buc] was born at Ely, the eldest son of Robert Bucke,
    and Elizabeth, the daughter of Peter Lee of Brandon Ferry; the grandson
    of Robert Bucke, and Jane, the daughter of Clement Higham; the
    great-grandson of Sir John Bucke, who, having helped Richard to a horse
    on Bosworth Field, was attainted for his zeal."--Chalmers' _Apology_,
    p. 488.

The MS. now in Mr. Corser's possession occurs in the _Bibliotheca
Heberiana_, Part xi. No. 98., and I observe, by referring to that volume,
that the compiler has the following note:--

    "This MS. is entirely in the handwriting of Sir George Buck, Master of
    the Revels in the reign of James I., as prepared by him for
    publication. The initials G. B. correspond with those of his name, and
    the handwriting is similar to a MS. Dedication of his poem to Lord
    Chancellor Egerton, which is preserved at Bridgewater House."

The authorship of _The Famous History of St. George_, then, rests solely
upon the initials "G. B.," and the similarity of the handwriting to that of
{74} Sir George Buc. Now it must be remembered that the MS. dedication was
written in 1605, and the _history_ after 1660! Surely an interval of
_fifty-five_ years must have made some difference in the penmanship of the
worthy Master of the Revels. I think we must receive the _comparison_ of
handwritings with considerable caution; and, unless some of your readers
can produce "new evidence" in favour of one or other of the claimants, I
much fear that your reverend correspondent will have to exclaim with Master
Ford in the play,--

 "_Buck._ I would I could wash myself of the _Buck_!"


I am not quite certain that I can satisfactorily answer Mr. Corser's query;
but at least I am able to show that _a_ Sir George Buck, seised in fee of
lands in Lincolnshire, did die in or about 1623. In the Report Office of
the Court of Chancery is a Report made to Lord Keeper Williams by Sir Wm.
Jones, who had been Lord Chief Justice in Ireland, dated the 10th Nov.
1623, respecting a suit referred to him by the Lord Keeper, in which
_Stephen Buck_ was plaintiff and _Robert Buck_ defendant. In this report is
contained a copy of the will of Sir George Buck, whom I supposed to be
_the_ Sir George Buck, the master of the Revels; and the will containing a
singular clause, disinheriting his brother Robert because he was alleged to
be a Jesuit, and it having been supposed that Sir George Buck died
intestate, I published an extract from it in my _Acta Cancellariæ_
(Benning, 1847). On further examination of the whole of the document in
question, I find it distinctly stated, and of course that statement was
made on evidence adduced, that Sir George Buck was seised in fee of certain
lands and tenements in Boston and Skydbrooke, both of which places, I need
scarcely say, are in Lincolnshire. It is therefore, at least, not
improbable that the testator was a native of Lincolnshire. It also appears
that the proceedings in Chancery were instituted previously to June, 1623;
and, inasmuch as Sir George Buck's will is recited in those proceedings, he
must have died before they were commenced, and not in September, 1623, as I
once supposed. It may, perhaps, aid Mr. Corser's researches to know that
the will (which is not to be found at Doctors' Commons) mentions, besides
the brother Robert, a sister, Cecilia Buck, who had a son, Stephen, who had
a son, George Buck, whom his great uncle, Sir George, made ultimate heir to
his lands in Lincolnshire.


Registrars' Office, Court of Chancery.

       *       *       *       *       *


Your SEXAGENARIAN who dates from "Shooter's Hill," has _not_ hit the mark
when he suggests that Anna Bouleyn's marriage with Henry VIII. (in the
teeth of the Church) is the hidden mystery of the popular old song,--

 "Sir Frog he would a-wooing go,
  Whether his mother was willing or no."

That some courtship in the history of the British monarchy, leaving a deep
impression on the public mind, gave rise to this generally diffused ballad,
is exceedingly probable; but the style and wording of the song are
evidently of a period much later than the age of Henry VIII. Might not the
madcap adventure of Prince Charles with Buckingham into Spain, to _woo the
Infanta_, be its real origin? "Heigho! for Antony Rowley" is the chorus.
Now "Old Rowley" was a pet name for Charles the Second, as any reader of
the Waverley Novels must recollect. No event was more likely to be talked
about and sung about at the time, the adventurous nature of the trip being
peculiarly adapted to the ballad-monger.


_"A Frog he would a-wooing go"_ (Vol. ii., p. 45.)--Your correspondent
T. S. D. is certainly right in his notion that the ballad of "A frog he
would a-wooing go" is very old, however fanciful may be his conjecture
about its personal or political application to Henry VIII. and Anne Boleyn.
That it could not refer to "the Cavaliers and the Roundheads," another of
T. S. D.'s notions, is clear from the fact, that it was entered at
Stationers' Hall in November, 1581; as appears by the quotation made by Mr.
Payne Collier, in his second volume of _Extracts_, printed for the
Shakspeare Society last year. It runs thus:--

    "Edward White. Lycensed unto him, &c., theis iiij. ballads followinge,
    that is to saie, A moste strange weddinge of the frogge and the mowse,"

Upon this entry Mr. Collier makes this note:

    "The ballad can hardly be any other than the still well-known comic
    song 'A Frog he would a-wooing go.'"

It may have been even older than 1581, when Edward White entered it; for it
is possible that it was then only a reprint of an earlier production. I,
like Mr. Collier, have heard it sung "in our theatres and streets," and,
like T. S. D., always fancied that it was ancient.


_Rowley Powley._--As generally inclined to the belief that everything is
older than anybody knows of, I am rather startled by "Rowley Powley" not
being as old as myself. I remember seeing mentioned somewhere, without any
reference to this chorus, that _rowley powley_ is a name for a plump fowl,
of which both "gammon and spinach" are posthumous connexions. I cannot help
thinking that this may be a clue to some prior occurrence of the chorus,
with or without {75} the song. If "derry down," which has been said to be
druidical, were judged of by the last song it went with, how old would be
the Druids?


"_A Frog he would a-wooing go._"--It may perhaps be interesting to some of
your correspondents on the subject of "A frog he would a-wooing go," to
know that there exists an Irish version of that woeful tale, which differs
in several respects from the ballad which has so long been familiar to
English ears. The burthen of "Heigho! says Rowley," does not occur in the
Hibernian composition, but a still less intelligible chorus supplies its
place. The air is exceedingly quaint, and seems to me to bear the stamp of
antiquity. The words are as follow:--

 "Misther Frog lived in a well,
    Heigho! my lanti-iddity!
  And the merry mouse in the mill,
    Terry heigho! for lang for liddity!
  Says Mr. Frog, 'I will go coort,'
    Heigho, &c.
 'Saddle me nag and polish me boots!'
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Frog came _to_ Lady Mouse's hall,
    Heigho, &c.
  Gave a rap and thundering call,
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'Where _is_ the people _of_ this house?'
    Heigho, &c.
 'Here am I,' says my Lady Mouse,
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'I've come to court Miss Kitty here,'
    Heigho, &c.
 'If that she can fancy me.'
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'Uncle Rat is not at home;'
    Heigho, &c.
 'He'll give you an answer--I have none,'
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Uncle Rat, when he came in,
    Heigho, &c.
 'Who's been here since I left home?'
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'Misther Frog, a worthy man;'
    Heigho, &c.
 'Give him a wife, Sir, if you can,'
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'Where shall we make the bride's bed?'
    Heigho, &c.
 'Down below, in the Horse's Head.'
    Terry heigho, &c.
 'What shall we have for the wedding supper?'
    Heigho, &c.
 'A roasted potato and a roll o' butter.'
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Supper was laid down to dine,
    Heigho, &c.
  Changed a farthing and brought up wine,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  First come in was a nimble bee,
    Heigho, &c.
  With his fiddle upon his knee,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Next come in was a creeping snail,
    Heigho, &c.
  With his bagpipes under his tail,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Next came in was a neighbour's pig,
    Heigho, &c.
 'Pray, good people, will ye play us a jig?'
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Next come in was a neighbour's hen,
    Heigho, &c.
  Took the fiddler by the wing,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Next come in was a neighbour's duck,
    Heigho, &c.
  Swallow'd the piper, head and pluck,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Next come in was a neighbour's cat,
    Heigho, &c.
  Took the young bride by the back,
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Misther Frog jumped down the well,
    Heigho, &c.
 'Zounds, I'll never go coort again!'
    Terry heigho, &c.
  Uncle Rat run up a wall,
    Heigho, &c.
 'Zounds, the divil's among you all!'
    Terry heigho, &c."

W. A. G.

       *       *       *       *       *

Replies to Minor Queries.

_Carucate of Land_ (Vol. ii., p. 9.).--The measure of the carucate was as
indefinite in Edward III.'s time as at an earlier period. It then, as
before, represented as much land as could be worked with one plough in a
year. I am fortunately enabled to give your correspondent E.V. a precise
answer to his Query. In a MS. survey of the Hospitallers' lands in England,
taken under the direction of Prior Philip Thame, A.D. 1338, which I
transcribed from the original, among the records of the order, I find in
the "extent" of the "Camera de Hetherington in comitatu Northampton,"--

    "Item. v Carucate terre continentes v^c acre terre: pretium cujuslibet,

    "Bæjulia de Eycle (_i. e._ Eagle in Lincolnshire) cum membris."

    "Et ibidem iiij. carucate terre, que continent v^c acras terre et apud
    le Wodehous iij carucate terre, que continent iij^c: pretium acre,

Here we have a decided instance of the variation in the number of acres
represented by the carucate. I have generally found that the nearest
approximation to correctness, where no other evidence is at hand, is to
consider the carucate as designating about 100 acres.

L. B. L.

_Carucate of Land._--A case in point is given in the 33rd vol. of the
_Archæologia_, p. 271. The {76} carucate frequently consisted of eight
bovatæ of arable land; but the number of acres appears to have varied not
only according to the quality of the soil, but according to the custom of
husbandry of the shire: for where a two-years' course, or crop and fallow,
was adopted, more land was adjudged to the carucate than where a
three-years' course obtained, the land lying fallow not being reckoned or
rateable. The object would appear to have been to obtain a carucate of
equal value throughout the kingdom.

B. W.

_Golden Frog and Sir John Poley_ (Vol. i., p. 214. and 372.).--Your
correspondent GASTROS suggests that "to the Low Countries, the land of
frogs, we must turn for the solution of this enigma," (Vol. i., p. 372.);
accordingly, it appears from the treatise of Bircherodius on the Knights of
the Elephant, an order of knighthood in Denmark, conferred upon none but
persons of the first quality and merit, that a frog is among the devices
adopted by them; and we need not further seek for a reason why this
_Symbolum Heroicum_ was worn by Sir John Poley, who served much under
Christian, king of Denmark (Vol. i., p. 214.), and distinguished himself
much by his military achievements in the Low Countries (p. 372.).

T. J.

_The Poley Frog._--More than half a century ago, I was present when this
singular appendage was the subject of conversation in a large literary
party, but being then a schoolboy I made "no note of it." My recollection
now is, that after some jokes on the name of Poley as that of a frog,
allusion was made to an old court story of King James II. throwing a frog
into the neck of William, third Earl of Pembroke. The story, with its
consequences, may be found in the _Tixall Letters_, vol. i. p. 5.; Wood's
_Athenæ Ox._, vol. i. p. 546.; Park's _Royal and Noble Authors_, vol. ii.
p. 249.

[Old English G].

I have never seen a head of any engraving of the portrait of Sir John
Poley, of Boxsted Hall, not Bexstead. I believe there is none.


_Bands_ (Vol. ii., p. 23.) are the descendants of the ruff a portion of the
ordinary civil costume of the sixteenth century. In the reign of James I.,
the ruff was occasionally exchanged for a wide stiff collar, standing out
horizontally and squarely, made of similar stuff, starched and wired, and
sometimes edged like the ruff with lace. These collars were called bands. A
good example occurs in the portrait of Shakspeare by Cornelius Jansen,
engravings of which are well known. At the end of the seventeenth century
these broad-falling bands were succeeded by the small Geneva bands, which
have ever since been retained by our clergymen and councillors, but in a
contracted form, having been originally _bonâ fide_ collars, the ends of
which hung negligently over the shoulders. (See Planché's _Brit. Costume_,
pp. 350. 390.) Bands are worn by the ecclesiastics in France and Italy, as
well as in England.

In the second number of _Popular Tracts Illustrating the Prayer-Book_, p.
3., it is suggested that bands are perhaps the remains of the amice, one of
the eucharistic vestments in use previous to the Reformation, which
consisted of a square cloth, so put on that one side, which was
embroidered, formed a collar round the neck, whilst the rest hung behind
like a hood. By analogy with the scarf of our Protestant clergy, which is
clearly the stole of the Roman Church retained under a different name, this
suggestion is not without some degree of plausibility.

The fact that the present academical costume is derived from the ordinary
civil dress of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, sufficiently
accounts for the retention of the bands as a part.


Surely bands are no part of the peculiar dress of the clergy, &c., but the
ordinary dress of the people, retained by certain classes or professions,
because they wished for something regular and distinctive. So the wigs of
the judges were the fashionable dress 150 years ago. It is curious that the
clergy have cut down their bands, while the lawyers still glory in
comparatively large and flowing ones. Bands altered greatly in their form.
Taylor, the Water Poet, I think, says--

 "The eighth Henry, as I understand,
  Was the first prince that ever wore a band,"

or, indeed, person of any sort. The date of the same thing in France is
mentioned in Vellay, but I forget it now.

C. B.

_Bishops and their Precedence_ (Vol. ii., p. 9.).--It may interest your
correspondent E. to refer to a passage in Baker's _Chronicle_, sub anno
1461, p. 204., which would tend to show that the precedency of the
spiritual barons was at that period disputed. That writer says:--

    "John Earl of Oxford, with his son Aubrey de Vere, &c., was convicted
    of treason and beheaded. John Earl of Oxford, in a former parliament,
    had disputed the question concerning the precedency of Temporal and
    Spiritual Barons, a bold attempt in those days, and by force of whose
    argument Judgment was given for the _Lords Temporal_."

Where will this judgment or any account of the dispute be found?


_"Imprest" and "Debenture"_ (Vol. ii., p. 40.).--_Imprest_ is derived from
the Italian _imprestare_, to lend, which is _im-præstare_, (Fr. _prêter_).
_Debentur_, or _Debenture_ (Lat. _debeo_), was originally a Customhouse
term, meaning a certificate or ticket presented by an exporter, when a
drawback or bounty was allowed on certain exported goods. Hence it seems
{77} to mean a certificate acknowledging a debt, and promising payment at a
specified time on the presentation of the certificate. Debentures are thus
issued by railway companies when they borrow money, and the certificates
for annual interest which accompany them are, so to speak,
_sub-debentures_. Perhaps this may throw _some_ light upon the matter.


_Charade_ (Vol. i., p. 10.).--The charade cited by QUÆSTOR is on my "Notes"
as the "Bishop of Salisbury's," and the following answer is said to be by a

 "Firm on the Rock of Christ, though lowly sprung,
  The Church invokes the Spirit's fiery Tongue;
  Those gracious breathings rouse but to controul
  The Storm and Struggle in the Sinner's Soul.
  Happy! ere long his carnal conflicts cease,
  And the Storm sinks in faith and gentle peace--
  Kings own its potent sway, and humbly bows
  The gilded diadem upon their brows--
  Its saving voice with Mercy speeds to all,
  But ah! how few who quicken at the call--
  Gentiles the favour'd 'little Flock' detest,
  And Abraham's children spit upon their rest.
  Once only since Creation's work, has night
  Curtain'd with dark'ning Clouds its saving light,
  What time the Ark majestically rode,
  Unscath'd upon the desolating flood--
  The Silver weigh'd for it, in all its strength
  For scarce three pounds were counted, while its length
  Traced in the Prophet's view with measur'd reed,
  Squared just a mile, as Rabbins are agreed--
  And now I feel entitled well to smile,
  Since Christ's Church bears the Palm in all our Isle."

I waited some time to see if any solution would be given of the charade;
and I now send you the one in my possession, in default of a better.


_Dutch Language_ (Vol. i., p. 383.).--E. V. asks what are the best _modern_
books for acquiring a knowledge of the Dutch language. If E. V. insist upon
_modern_ books, he cannot have better than Hendrik Conscience's novels, or
Gerrits's _Zoon des Volks_. I would, however, advise him to get a volume of
Jacob Cats' _Poems_, the language of which is not antiquated, and is
idiomatic without being difficult to a beginner.

H. B. C.

_"Construe" and "Translate"_ (Vol ii., p. 22.).--It is very common, I
apprehend, in language, for two words, originally of the same meaning, or
two spellings of the same word, to be gradually appropriated by usage to
two subordinate uses, applications, and meanings of the word respectively,
and that merely by accident, as to which of the two is taken for one of the
subdivisions, and which for the other. We have made such an appropriation
in our own time,--despatch and dispatch.

It may be curious, however, to inquire how far back the distinction
mentioned by your correspondent is found.

"Construe," originally, must probably have meant, not to turn from one
language into another, but to explain the construction, or what is called
by the Greek name syntax, much like what in regard to a single word is
called parsing.

C. B.

_Dutton Family_ (Vol. ii., p. 21.).--B. will find the _Dutton_ proviso in
the statute 17 Geo. II. explained by reference to Ormerod's _Cheshire_,
vol. i. pp. 36. 477. 484.; Lyson's _Cheshire_; Blount's _Antient Tenures_,
298., &c. An early grant by one of the Lacy family transferred to Hugh de
Dutton and his heirs "magistratum omnium leccatorum et meritricum totius
Cestriæ." In the fifteenth century the jurisdiction was claimed by the
Dutton family, in respect of the lordship or manor of Dutton, and was then
confined to a jurisdiction over the minstrels and musicians of the
palatinate and city of Chester, who constituted, I presume, a department
among the _leccatores_, or licorish fellows, mentioned above. In virtue of
this jurisdiction the lord of Dutton had the advowry or "advocaria" of the
minstrels of the district, and annually licensed them at a _Court of
Minstrelsy_, where the homage consisted of a jury of sworn fiddlers; and
certain dues, namely, flagons of wine and a lance or flagstaff, were yearly
rendered to the lord. The last court was held in 1756.

As the early Vagrant Acts included "minstrels" in their definition of
rogues and vagabonds, it is evident that the suitors of the Minstrelsy
Court would have run the risk of commitment to the House of Correction and
a whipping, if the acts had not specially excepted the franchise of the
Dutton family from their operation. The earliest statutes are 14 Eliz. c.
5.; 39 Eliz. c. 4.; and 43 Eliz. c. 9. Section 27. of the last Act clearly
shows that it was the power of licensing minstrels which the proviso of the
acts was intended to save. The pedigree of the Dutton family will be found
in the volume of Ormerod already cited.

E. S.

June 5. 1850.

"_Laus tua, non tua fraus_," &c. (Vol. i., p. 416.).--The lines were
written by Philelphus on Pope Pius II., as is stated in the book called
_Les Bigarrures du Seigneur des Accords_, p. 173. of the edit. 1662.

C. B.

In a small work, entitled _Specimens of Macaronic Poetry_, 8vo., 1831, the
verses quoted by "O." are stated to have been written by some poet (not
named) in praise of Pope Clement VI. or Pius II., but of which learned
authorities do not agree. It seems the poet was afraid he might not receive
such a reward as, according to his own estimate, he deserved, and therefore
retained the power of converting his flattery into abuse, by simply giving
{78} his friends the cue to commence from the last word, and begin
backwards. The following are other verses of the same sort:--

 "Pontifici sua sint Divino Numine tuto
  Culmina, nec montes hos petat omnipotens."

 "Cæsareum tibi sit felici sidere nomen,
  Carole, nec fatum sit tibi Cæsareum."

W. G. S.

"O." is referred to a low and scurrilous translation, or rather imitation
of the epigrams of Martial and others, purporting to be "by the Rev. Mr.
Scott, M.A.," and published in London in 1773.

Therein the lines quoted by "O." are given, accompanied by a sorry attempt
at translation; and the epigram is attributed to

    "One Cianconius, a Dominican Friar, in honour of Pope Clement the

A. E. B.


_Mother of Thomas à Becket_ (Vol. i., pp. 415. 490.).--Thierry, in the 8th
vol. of his _Histoire de la Conquête de l'Angleterre par les Normands_,
quotes as an authority for the account of the Eastern origin of the mother
of Thomas à Becket, _Vita et Processus S. Thomæ Cantuariensis, seu
Quadripartita Historia_, cap. ii. fol. 3.

W. G. S.

_Medal of Stukeley._--In answer to Mr. BRITTON'S Queries (Vol. i., p. 122.,
and Vol. ii., p. 40.), I beg to inform him that the medal of Stukeley was
executed soon after that eminent antiquary's death by an artist of the name
of Gaal, who was not a die-sinker, but a modeller and chaser. The medal is
rare, but not unique: I have one in my own collection, and I have, I think,
seen one or two others. They are all cast in a mould and chased.


June 13. 1850.

_Dulcarnon_ (Vol. i., p. 254.).--Has _Dulcarnon_ any reference to the
Hindostanee _Dhoulcarnein_, two-horned,--the epithet constantly applied in
India to Alexander the Great, or Iskander, as they call him? It seems not a
bad word for a dilemma or puzzle.

H. W.


_Practice of Scalping_.--Your correspondent T. J. will find in Mr. Layard's
_Nineveh and its Remains_ (vol. ii. p. 374.) the following note:--

    "The Scythians _scalped_ and flayed their enemies, and used their skins
    as horse trappings."--_Herod._ iv. 64.

G. R.


_Scalping._--Perhaps your correspondent T. J. (Vol. ii., p. 12.) may
recollect the allusion to "scalping," in Psalm lxviii. 21.; upon which
verse an argument has been based in favour of the supposition, that the
aborigines of America are derived from the ten tribes of Israel.


_Derivation of Penny_ (Vol. i., pp. 384. 411.).--Akerman's _Numismatic
Manual_ (p. 228.) has, under the head of "Penny," the following remarks:--

    "The penny is next in antiquity. It is first mentioned in the laws of
    Ina. The term has been derived by various writers from almost every
    European language; but the conjecture of Wachter, as noticed by Lye,
    seems the most reasonable. This writer derives it from the Celtic word
    _pen_, head; the heads of the Saxon princes being stamped on the
    earliest pennies. The fact of the _testoon_ of later times having been
    so named, certainly adds weight to the opinion of Wachter."

W. G. S.

       *       *       *       *       *


"_By Hook or by Crook_" (Vol. i., p. 405.).--The following extract may,
perhaps, by multiplying instances, tend to corroborate the supposed origin
of the above saying:--

    "Not far from them [Peverell's Crosses], in the parish of Egloshayle,
    is another moonstone [granite] cross near Mount Charles, called the
    Prior's Cross, on which is cut the figure of a _hook_ and a _crook_, in
    memory of the privilege granted by him to the poor of Bodmin, for
    gathering for fire-boot and house-boot such boughs and branches of such
    trees in his contiguous wood of Dunmere, as they could reach with a
    _hook and a crook_ without further damage to the trees. From whence
    arose the Cornish proverb, _they will have it by hook or by
    crook_."--Hitchins and Drewe, _Hist. Cornwall_, p. 214. vol. ii. edit.


_Burning dead Bodies._--In his remarks on "ashes to ashes," CINIS says
(Vol. i., p.22.) that "the burning of the dead does not appear to be in
itself an anti-christian ceremony," &c.: he is mistaken, for the early
Christians, like the Jews, never burned their dead, but buried them. The
catacombs of Rome and Naples, besides those in other places, were
especially used for sepulture; and if CINIS wish for proofs, he will find
an abundance in Rock's _Hierurgia_, t. ii. p. 802., &c.


_Etymology of "Barbarian," &c._--Passow, in his Lexicon (ed. Liddell and
Scott), s.v. [Greek: barbaros], observes that the word was originally
applied to "all that were not Greeks, or that did not speak Greek. It was
used of all defects which the Greeks thought foreign to themselves and
natural to other nations: but as the Hellenes and Barbarians were most of
all _separated by language_, the word had always especial reference to this
[Greek: glôssa barbara], Soph. Aj. 1263, &c." He considers the word as
probably an onomatopoeion, to express the sound of a foreign tongue. (Cf.
Gibbon, c. li.; Roth, _Ueber {79} Sinn u. Gebrauch des Wortes Barbar._
Nürnberg, 1814.) I am disposed to look for the root in the Hebr. [Hebrew:
BARAR] "_bâr[=a]r_," _separavit_, in its Pilpel form, [Hebrew: BARBAR]
"_barbâr;_" hence, "one who is _separated_," "a foreigner." And even though
Clel. Voc. 126., n., admits that _purus_, "clean," "_separated_ from
dross," originally signifies cleansing by fire, [Greek: pur], yet both it
and _far-farris_, "bread-corn," i. e. _separated_ from the husk, and
_fur-fur_, "bran," which is _separated_ from the flour, may find their
origin possibly from the same source.

E. S. T.

_Royal and distinguished Disinterments._--It is suggested that a volume of
deep and general interest might be very easily formed by collecting and
arranging the various notices that have from time to time appeared, of the
disinterment of royal and distinguished personages. This hint seems
deserving of the attention of Messrs. Nichols.

J. H. M.

       *       *       *       *       *



The great interest excited by the further discovery in August last, of
tesselated pavements at Cirencester induced Professor Buckman and Mr.
Newmarch at once to issue proposals for a work, descriptive not only of
those beautiful specimens of Roman art, but also of all such other of the
numerous remains found in the same locality as they could satisfactorily
identify. The result was, such a well-filled Subscription List, and such
ready co-operation on the part of those who had collectetd and preserved
such objects, as have enabled these Gentlemen to produce, under the title
of _Illustrations of the Remains of Roman Art in Cirencester, the Site of
Ancient Corinium_, a work which will not only gratify the antiquary by its
details, and the beauty and fidelity of its engravings, but enable the
general reader, without any great exercise of imagination, to picture to
himself the social condition of Corinium when garrisoned by Roman cohorts,

    "'Ere the wide arch of the ranged Empire fell."

To the grandeur of form, dignity of character, and great breadth of
treatment exhibited in these Pavements,--Mr. Westmacott, the Royal
Academician, bears his testimony; and the fidelity with which they have
been copied in the valuable work before us reflects the highest credit upon
all parties engaged in its production.

Messrs. Puttick and Simpson (191. Piccadilly) will sell on Wednesday next
an extraordinary Collection of MSS., comprising a cotemporary MS. of
Occleve's Poems, Autograph Poetry of Mary Queen of Scots; Legend of St.
Molaisse, an Irish MS. of the 11th century, &c., and, among other things,
many thousand early Charters, from the time of the Conqueror to the 17th

We have received the following Catalogues:--Charles Dolman's (61. New Bond
Street) Catalogue of Books in various Languages; Supplement E., comprising
many of the works of the Fathers, Ecclesiastical History, &c.; John
Petheram's (94. High Holborn) Catalogue, Part CXIII., No. 7. for 1850, of
Old and New Books.

       *       *       *       *       *


(_In continuation of Lists in former Nos._)

ARISTOTLE, Buhle's edition, vol. v.


KANT'S SAEMMTLICHE WERKE, edition of Schuberand Rosenkrantz (von Leipsic),
Part XI.--Query, Has this eleventh part been published?

*** Letters, stating particulars and lowest price, _carriage free_, to be
sent to Mr. BELL, Publisher of "NOTES AND QUERIES," 186. Fleet Street.

       *       *       *       *       *

Notices to Correspondents.

VOLUME THE FIRST, _Complete with Index, may now be had, price 9s. 6d.,
bound in cloth_. THE INDEX, _which we publish this day, is, we trust,
sufficiently full to satisfy to the utmost the wishes of our Subscribers.
We feel that, if called upon at any time to establish the utility of_ NOTES
AND QUERIES, _we may confidently point to the Index as a proof that the
Literary Inquirer, be his particular branch of Study what it may, will not
search in vain in our pages for valable Notes and Illustrations of it_.

       *       *       *       *       *

Just published in 8vo., with a Portrait and Plates, Price 12s., cloth; or,
in royal 8vo. (large paper), Price 18s. 6d. cloth,

DILSTON HALL; or, Memoirs of the Right Hon. James Radcliff, Earl of
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to Bamburgh Castle; with an Account of Lord Crewe's Charities, and a Memoir
of the Noble Founder. Forming the Second Series of Descriptive and
Historical Notices of Northumbrian Churches and Castles. By WILLIAM SIDNEY
GIBSON, Esq., F.S.A., F.G.S., Barrister-at-Law.


       *       *       *       *       *

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       *       *       *       *       *

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       *       *       *       *       *

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NINEVEH AND ITS REMAINS: being a Narrative of Researches and Discoveries
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    we question whether a more enlightened or a more enterprising traveller
    than Mr. Layard is to be met with in the annals of our modern English
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       *       *       *       *       *


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at 19l. 3s. 6d., are at present offered at the reduced price of 9l. for the

N. B. The number of copies being small, early application should be made.

       *       *       *       *       *

Printed by THOMAS CLARK SHAW, of No. 8. New Street Square at No. 5. New
Street Square, in the Parish of St. Bride, in the City of London; and
published by GEORGE BELL, of No. 186. Fleet Street, in the Parish of St.
Dunstan in the West, in the City of London, Publisher, at No. 186. Fleet
Street aforesaid.--Saturday, June 29, 1850.

*** End of this Doctrine Publishing Corporation Digital Book "Notes and Queries, Number 35, June 29, 1850 - A Medium of Inter-communication for Literary Men, Artists, - Antiquaries, Genealogists, etc" ***

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