Notes and Queries, Number 79, May 3, 1851 - A Medium of Inter-communication for Literary Men, Artists,

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Title: Notes and Queries, Number 79, May 3, 1851 - A Medium of Inter-communication for Literary Men, Artists, - Antiquaries, Genealogists, etc
Author: Various
Language: English
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Transcriber's note: A few typographical errors have been corrected: they
are listed at the end of the text.

* * * * *

{345}

NOTES AND QUERIES:

A MEDIUM OF INTER-COMMUNICATION FOR LITERARY MEN, ARTISTS, ANTIQUARIES,
GENEALOGISTS, ETC.

* * * * *

"When found, make a note of."--CAPTAIN CUTTLE.

* * * * *

No. 79.]
SATURDAY, MAY 3. 1851.
[Price Threepence. Stamped Edition 4d.

* * * * *

CONTENTS.

NOTES:-- Page
Illustrations of Chaucer, No. V. 345
Foreign English--Guide to Amsterdam 346
Seven Children at a Birth three Times following 347
Ramasshed, Meaning of the Term 347
Authors of the Poetry of the Anti-Jacobin, by E. Hawkins 348
Minor Notes:--Egg and Arrow Ornament--Defoe's
Project for purifying the English Language--Great
Fire of London--Noble or Workhouse Names 349

QUERIES:--
Passages in the New Testament illustrated from Demosthenes 350
The House of Maillé 351
Minor Queries:-- Meaning of "eign"--The Bonny
Crayat--What was the Day of the Accession of Richard
the Third?--Lucas Family--Watch of Richard
Whiting--Laurence Howel, the Original Pilgrim--Churchwardens'
Accounts, &c. of St. Mary-de-Castro,
Leicester--Aristotle and Pythagoras--When Deans
first styled Very Reverend--Form of Prayer at the
Healing--West Chester--The Milesians--Round
Robbin--Experto credo Roberto--Captain Howe--Bactria 351

REPLIES:--
The Family of the Tradescants, by Dr. E. F. Rimbault 353
Meaning of Venville, by E. Smirke 355
Replies to Minor Queries:--Newburgh Hamilton--Pedigree
of Owen Glendower--Mind your P's and Q's--The
Sempecta at Croyland--Solid-hoofed Pigs--Porci
solide-pedes--Sir Henry Slingsby's Diary--Criston,
Somerset--Tradesmen's Signs--Emendation
of a Passage in Virgil 356

MISCELLANEOUS:--
Notes on Books, Sales, Catalogues, &c. 358
Books and Odd Volumes wanted 358
Notices to Correspondents 358
Advertisements 359

* * * * *

Notes.

ILLUSTRATIONS OF CHAUCER NO. V.

_The Arke of Artificial Day_.

Before proceeding, to point out the indelible marks by which Chaucer has,
as it were, stereotyped the true date of the journey to Canterbury, I shall
clear away another stumbling-block, still more insurmountable to Tyrwhitt
than his first difficulty of the "halfe cours" in Aries, viz. the seeming
inconsistency in statements (1.) and (2.) in the following lines of the
prologue to the Man of Lawe's tale:--

{ "Oure hoste saw wel that the bright sonne,
(1.) { The arke of his artificial day, had ironne
{ The fourthe part and halfe an houre and more,
* * * *
{ And saw wel that the shadow of every tree
{ Was as in length of the same quantitie,
{ That was the body erecte that caused it,
{ And therefore by the shadow he toke his wit
(2.) { That Phebus, which that shone so clere and bright,
{ Degrees was five and fourty clombe on hight,
{ And for that day, as in that latitude
{ It was ten of the clok, he gan conclude."

The difficulty will be best explained in Tyrwhitt's own words:--

"Unfortunately, however, this description, though seemingly intended to
be so accurate, will neither enable us to conclude with the MSS. that
it was '_ten of the clock_,' nor to fix upon any other hour; as the two
circumstances just mentioned are not found to coincide in any part of
the 28th, or of any other day of April, in this
climate."--_Introductory Discourse_, § xiv.

In a foot-note, Tyrwhitt further enters into a calculation to show that, on
the 28th of April, the fourth part of the day and half an hour and more
(even with the liberal allowance of a quarter of an hour to the indefinite
phrase '_and more_') would have been completed by nine o'clock A.M. at the
latest, and therefore at least an hour too soon for coincidence with (2.).

Now one would think that Tyrwhitt, when he found his author relating facts,
"_seemingly intended to be so accurate_," would have endeavoured to
discover whether there might not be some hidden meaning in them, the
explaining of which might make that consistent, which, at first, was
apparently the reverse.

Had he investigated with such a spirit, he must have discovered that the
expression "arke of the artificial day" _could not_, in this instance,
receive its obvious and usual meaning, of the horary duration from sunrise
to sunset--

And for this simple reason: That such a meaning would _presuppose a
knowledge of the hour_--of the very thing in request--and which was about
{346} to be discovered by "our hoste," who "toke his wit" from the sun's
altitude for the purpose! But he knew already that the fourth part of the
day IN TIME had elapsed, he must necessarily have also known what that time
was, without the necessity of calculating it!

Now, Chaucer, whose choice of expression on scientific subjects is often
singularly exact, says, "Our hoste _saw_ that the sonne," &c.; he must
therefore have been referring to some visible situation: because,
afterwards, when the time of day has been obtained from calculation, the
phrase changes to "_gan conclude_" that it was ten of the clock.

It seems, therefore, certain that, even setting aside the question of
consistency between (1.) and (2.), we must, _upon other grounds_, assume
that Chaucer had some meaning in the expression "arke of the artificial
day," different from what must be admitted to be its obvious and received
signification.

To what other ark, then, could he have been alluding, if not to the
_horary_ diurnal ark?

I think, to the AZIMUTHAL ARCH OF THE HORIZON included between the point of
sunrise and that of sunset!

The situation of any point in that arch is called its bearing; it is
estimated by reference to the points of the compass; it is therefore
_visually_ ascertainable: and it requires no previous knowledge of the hour
in order to determine when the sun has completed the fourth, or any other,
portion of it.

Here, then, is _primâ facie_ probability established in favour of this
interpretation. And if, upon examination, we find that it also clears away
the discrepancy between (1.) and (2.), probability becomes certainty.

Assuming, upon evidence which I shall hereafter explain, that the sun's
declination, on the day of the journey, was 13° 26' North, or thirteen
degrees and half,--the sun's bearing at rising, in the neighbourhood of
London, would be E.N.E., at setting W.N.W.; the whole included arch, 224°;
and the time at which the sun would complete one-fourth, or have the
bearing, S.E. by E., would be about 20 minutes past nine A.M.,--thus
leaving 40 minutes to represent Chaucer's "halfe an hour and more!"

A very remarkable approximation--which converts a statement apparently
contradictory, into a strong confirmation of the deduction to be obtained
from the other physical facts grouped together by Chaucer with such
extraordinary skill!

On the other hand, it is impossible to deny that the "hoste's" subsequent
admonition to the pilgrims to make the best use of their time, warning them
that "the fourthe partie of this day is gon," seems again to favour the
idea that it is the day's actual horary duration that is alluded to.

This can be only hypothetically accounted for by observing that in this, as
in many other instances, Chaucer seems to delight in a sort of disguised
phraseology; as though to veil his true meaning, and designedly to create
scientific puzzles to exercise the knowledge and discernment of his
readers.

A. E. B.

Leeds, April 14. 1851.

* * * * *

FOREIGN ENGLISH--GUIDE TO AMSTERDAM.

I doubt not many of your readers will have been as much amused as myself
with the choice specimens of Foreign English enshrined in your pages. When
at Amsterdam, some years since, I purchased a _Guide_ to that city, which I
regard as a considerable literary curiosity in the same line. It was
published at Amsterdam, by E. Maascamp, in 1829, and contains from
beginning to end a series of broken English, professing all the while to be
written by an Englishman.

It commences with the following "Advertisement:"

"The city of Amsterdam--remarkable as being one of the chief metropoles
of Europe, and as being in many respects the general market of whole
the universe; justly celebrated for--its large interior canals, on both
of their sides enlivened and sheltered by ranges of large, thick, and
beautiful trees, and presenting, on large broad and neatly kept, most
regularly pav'd quays, long chains of sumptuous habitations, or rather
palaces of the principal and _weathy_ merchants; moreover remarkable by
its Museum for the objects of the fine arts, &c., its numberless public
edifices adapted either to the _cultivation_ of arts, or to the
exertions of trade, or to _establishments_ charitable purposes, or of
temples of all manners of divine worship--the city of Amsterdam, we
say," &c. It is dated "This 15^{the} of Juin, 1829."

In page 14. the author gives us an account of his habits, &c.:--

"I live in Amsterdam since some considerable time I drink no strong
liquors, nor do I smoke tobacco and with all this--I have not been
_attacked_ by those agues and fevers w^h frequently reign here from the
month of Juin to the end of the autumn: and twenty foreigners whom I
know, do follow the same system, and are still as healthy as I myself;
while I have seen a great many of natives taking their drams and
smoking their pipes _ad libitem_, and moreover _chawing_ tobacco in a
quite disgusting manner, who," &c.

An Amsterdam Sunday, p. 42.:

"On sundays and holydays the shops and warehouses, and, _intra muros_,
those of public entertainment are _close_: the devotees go to church,
and sanctify the sabbath. Others go to walk outside the towngates:
after their walk, they hasten to fine public-play-gardens, where wine,
thea, &c. is sold. Neither the mobility remains idle at _these_
entertainments. Every one invites his damsel, and joyously they enter
play-gardens of a little less brilliancy than the former. There, at the
crying sound of an instrument that _rents_ the ear, {347} accompanied
by the delightful handle-organs and the rustic triangle, their tributes
are paid to Terpsichore; every where a similitude of talents: the
dancing outdoes not the musician."

Description of the Assize Court:

"The forefront has a noble and sublime aspect, and is particularly
characteristical to what it ought to represent. It is built in a
division of three fronts in the corinthic order: each of them consists
in four raizing columns, resting upon a general basement, from the one
end of the forefront to the other, and supporting a cornish, equally
running all over the face; upon this cornish rests a balustrad, like
the other pieces altogether of Bremen-hardstone. The middle front,
serving for the chief entrance, is adorned with the provincial arms,
sculpted by Mr. Gabriel, &c.... Every where a sublime plan, and exact
execution is exhibited here, and the whole tends as much to the
architects, who are the undertakers of it, as they have earned great
praizes by building anew the burnt Lutheran church."

I will not trespass on your space by any further extracts; but these will
suffice to show that my book is _sui generis_, and worth commemoration.

C. W. B.

* * * * *

SEVEN CHILDREN AT A BIRTH THREE TIMES FOLLOWING.

Your correspondent N. D.'s papers (Vol. ii., p. 459., and Vol. iii., p. 64)
have reminded me of another remarkable instance of fecundity related by the
well-known civil engineer JAN ADRIAENSZ. LEEG-WATER, in his _Kleyne
Chronycke_, printed at Amsterdam in 1654:

"Some years since," says he, p. 31., "I was at _Wormer_, at an inn near
the town-hall: the landlady, whose name was _Frankjen_, told me of the
Burgomaster of _Hoorn_, who in the spring went over the (Zuyder?) sea
to buy oxen, and going into a certain house he found seven little
children sitting by the fire, each with a porringer in its hand, and
eating rice-milk, or pap, with a spoon; on which the Burgomaster said
'Mother, you are very kind to your neighbours, since they leave their
children to your care.' 'No,' said the woman, they are all my own
children, which I had at one birth; and if you will wait a moment, I
will show you more that will surprise you.' She then fetched seven
other children _a birth_ older: so she had fourteen children at two
births. Then the woman said to the Burgomaster, 'I am now _enceinte_,
and I think in the same way as before: if you come here next year, call
upon me again.' And so, the next year, when the Burgomaster went over
the sea, he called upon the woman and the woman had again brought forth
seven children at a birth. Thus the woman had at three births
twenty-one children."

I subjoin the original of which the above is a literal translation.

J. S.

Woudenberg, April, 1851.

* * * * *

RAMASSHED, MEANING OF THE TERM.

In the curious volume recently edited by Sir Henry Ellis for the Camden
Society, entitled _The Pilgrymage of Syr R. Guylforde, Knyght_, a singular
term occurs, which may claim a note of explanation. It is found in the
following passage:

"Saterdaye to Suse, Noualassa, and to Lyungborugh; and at the sayd
Noualassa we toke moyles to stey us vp the mountayne, and toke also
marones to kepe vs frome fallynge. And from the hyght of the mounte
down to Lyuyngborugh I was ramasshed, whiche is a right strange
thinge."--P. 80.

Sir Henry has not bestowed upon us here any of those erudite annotations,
which have customarily enhanced the interest of works edited under his
care.

Sir Richard Guylforde was on his homeward course from the Holy Places by
way of Pavia, where he visited the convent and church which contained the
shrine and relics of St. Augustine, as also the tomb of Lionel, Duke of
Clarence, second son of Edward III., whose monumental inscription (not to
be found in Sandford's _Genealogical History_) the worthy knight copied.

On the 13th Feb. 1506, Sir Richard approached the ascent of Mont Cenis by
the way of S. Ambrogio and Susa. At the village of Novalese, now in ruins,
the party took mules, to aid their ascent, and _marroni_, long-handled
mattocks, or pick-axes, to prevent their falling on the dangerous
declivities of the snow. The journey was formerly made with frightful
expedition by means of a kind of sledge--an expedient termed _la
ramasse_--which enabled the traveller, previously to the construction of
that extraordinary road, well known to most readers, to effect in a few
minutes a perilous descent of upwards of 6000 feet. The _ramasse_, as
Cotgrave informs us, was--

"A kind of high sled, or wheelbarrow, whereon travellers are carried
downe certaine steep and slippery hils in Piemont."

Its simplest form had probably been a kind of fagot of
brushwood,--_ramazza_, or a besom, not much unlike the rapid locomotive of
witches, who were called in old times _ramassières_, from their supposed
practice of riding on a _ramée_, _ramasse_, or besom. At the present time
even, it occasionally occurs that an adventurous traveller crossing the
Mont Cenis is tempted to glide down the rapid descent, in preference to the
long course of the zigzag road; and remember to have heard at Lauslebourg
the tale, doubtless often related, of an eccentric _Milord_ who ascended
the heights thrice from that place, a journey of some hours, for the
gratification of the repeated excitement caused by a descent on the
_ramasse_ in about as many minutes. The cranium of a horse, as it was
stated, was the vehicle often preferred for this curious adventure: and the
{348} traveller guided or steadied his course by trailing a long staff, a
practice for security well known to the Alpine tourist. This may probably
have been the use of the "marones" taken by Sir Richard Guyldeford and his
party at Novalese.

The terms, to be "ramasshed," is not, as I believe, wholly disused in
France. It was brought to the metropolis with the strange amusement known
as the _Montagne Russe_. In the valuable _Complément du Dictionnaire de
l'Académie_, compiled under the direction of Louis Barré, we find the
following phrase:

"Se faire ramasser, se dit aujourd'hui, dans une acception
particulière, pour, Se faire lancer dans un char, du haut des
élévations artificielles qui se trouvent dans les jardins publics."

Such a disport had been known previously to the expedition to Moscow, and
the favourite divertisement _à la Russe_, so much in vogue amongst the
Parisians for a few subsequent years. Roquefort informs us that--

"_Ramasse_ étoit le nom d'un jeu que nous avions apporté des Alpes, où
il est encore en usage pendant l'hiver, et principalement en temps de
neige."

ALBERT WAY.

* * * * *

AUTHORS OF THE POETRY OF THE ANTI-JACOBIN.

The following notices of the writers of many of the poetical pieces in the
_Anti-Jacobin_ may prove interesting to many of your readers. They are
derived from the following copies, and each name is authenticated by the
initials of the authority upon which each piece is ascribed to particular
persons:

C. Canning's own copy of the poetry.
B. Lord Burghersh's copy.
W. Wright the publisher's copy.
U. Information of W. Upcott, amanuensis.

The copy of the _Anti-Jacobin_ to which I refer is the fourth, 1799, 8vo.

Page. VOL. I.
31. Introd. to Poetry Canning.

35. Inscript. for Door of Cell, Canning,}
&c. Frere, } C.

71. Sapphics: Knifegrinder Frere, }
Canning,} C.

103. Invasio Hely Addington, W.

136. La Sainte Guillolem Canning,}
Frere, } C.
Hammond, B.

169. Soldier's Friend Canning,}
Frere, } C.
Ellis, B.
Sonnet to Liberty Lord Carlisle, B.

201. Dactylics Canning, B.
Gifford, W.
Ipsa mali Hortatrix, &c. Marq. Wellesley, U.
Frere, B.

236. Parent of countless Crimes, Marq. Wellesley, U.
&c. Frere, B.

263. The Choice Geo. Ellis, B.

265. Duke and taxing Man Bar. Macdonald, C. ,B.

267. Epigram Frere, B.

301. Ode to Anarchy Lord Morpeth, B.

303. You have heard of Reubel Frere, B.

371. Bard of the borrow'd Lyre Canning, C.
Hammond, B.

380. Ode to Lord Moira Geo. Ellis, C., B.

422. Bit of an Ode to Mr. Fox Geo. Ellis, C.
Frere, B.

452. Anne and Septimius Geo. Ellis, C.

486. Foe to thy Country's Foes Geo. Ellis, B.

489. Lines under Bust of Ch. Fox Frere, B.

490. ----under Bust of certain
Orator Geo. Ellis, B.

525. Progress of Man Canning, C.
Gifford, W.
Frere, B.

558. Progress of Man Canning, C.
Hammond, B.

598. Vision Geo. Ellis, B.
Gifford, W.

627. Ode: Whither, O Bacchus! Canning, C.

VOL. II.

21. Chevy Chace Bar. Macdonald, C., B.

98. Progress of Man Canning, }
Frere, } C.
Geo. Ellis, B.

134. Jacobin Nares, W.

168 Loves of the Triangles Frere, C.
Canning, B.

200. Loves of the Triangles Geo. Ellis, C., W.
Canning, B.

204. Loves of Triangles: So
with dark Dirge Canning, W.

205. "Romantic Ashboun." The road down Ashboun
Hill winds in front of Ashboun Hall,
then the residence of the Rev. ---- Leigh, who
married a relation of Mr. Canning's, and to
whom Mr. Canning was a frequent visitor. E. H.

236. Brissot's Ghost Frere, B.

274. Loves of the Triangles Canning, } B., W., C.
Gifford, } C.
Frere, } C.

312. Consolatory Address Lord Morpeth, B.

315. Elegy Canning, } B., C.
Gifford, } C.
Frere, } C.

343. Ode to my Country Frere, }
B.B., } C.
Hammond, B.

388. Ode to Director Merlin Lord Morpeth, B.

420. The Lovers Frere, }
Gifford, } C.
G. Ellis, }
Canning, } B.

451. Frere, } B.
Gifford, }
Ellis, } C.
Canning, }

498. Affectionate Effusion Lord Morpeth, B.

{349}
532. Translation of a Letter Gifford,}
Ellis, }C.
Canning,} B.
Frere, }

602. Ballynahinch Canning, C.
Viri eruditi Canning, B.

623. New Morality Canning, }B.
Frere, }
Gifford, }C.
G. Ellis,}

From Mental Mists Frere, W.
Yet venial Vices, &c. Canning, W.

624. Bethink thee, Gifford, &c. These lines were
written by Mr. Canning some years before he
had any personal acquaintance with Mr. Gifford.

625. Awake! for shame! Canning, W.

628. Fond Hope! Frere, W.

629. Such is the liberal Justice Canning, W.

631. O Nurse of Crimes Frere, }
Canning, }W.
G. Ellis,}

632. See Louvet Canning, W.

633. But hold severer Virtue Frere, }
Canning,}W.

634. To thee proud Barras bows Frere, }
Canning,}W.
Ellis, }

635. Ere long perhaps Gifford,}
Ellis, }W.

Couriers and Stars Frere, }
Canning,}W.

637. Britain beware Canning, W.

Wright, the publisher of the _Anti-Jacobin_, lived at 169. Piccadilly, and
his shop was the general morning resort of the friends of the ministry, as
Debrell's was of the oppositionists. About the time when the _Anti-Jacobin_
was contemplated, Owen, who had been the publisher of Burke's pamphlets,
failed. The editors of the _Anti-Jacobin_ took his house, paying the rent,
taxes, &c., and gave it up to Wright, reserving to themselves the first
floor, to which a communication was opened through Wright's house. Being
thus enabled to pass to their own rooms through Wright's shop, where their
frequent visits did not excite any remarks, they contrived to escape
particular observation.

Their meetings were most regular on Sundays, but they not unfrequently met
on other days of the week, and in their rooms were chiefly written the
poetical portions of the work. What was written was generally left open
upon the table, and as others of the party dropped in, hints or suggestions
were made; sometimes whole passages were contributed by some of the parties
present, and afterwards altered by others, so that it is almost impossible
to ascertain the names of the authors. Where, in the above notes, a piece
is ascribed to different authors, the conflicting statements may arise from
incorrect information, but sometimes they arise from the whole authorship
being assigned to one person, when in fact both may have contributed. If we
look at the references, vol. ii. pp. 420. 532. 623., we shall see Mr.
Canning naming several authors, whereas Lord Burghersh assigns all to one
author. Mr. Canning's authority is here more to be relied upon. "New
Morality" Mr. Canning assigns generally to the four contributors; Mr.
Wright has given some interesting particulars by appropriating to each his
peculiar portion.

Gifford was the working editor, and wrote most of the refutations and
corrections of the "Lies," "Mistakes," and "Misrepresentations."

The papers on finance were chiefly by Pitt: the first column was frequently
for what he might send; but his contributions were uncertain, and generally
very late, so that the space reserved for him was sometimes filled up by
other matter. He only once met the editors at Wright's.

Upcott, who was at the time assistant in Wright's shop, was employed as
amanuensis, to copy out for the printer the various contributions, that the
authors' handwriting might not be detected.

EDW. HAWKINS.

_The Anti-Jacobin_ (Vol. iii., p. 334.).--In a copy of the _Poetry of the
Anti-Jacobin_, now in my possession, occurs this note in the autograph of
Mr. James Boswell:--

"These lines [_Lines written by Traveller at Czarco-zelo_] were written
by William PITT--as I learnt from his nephew on the 28th of May 1808,
at a dinner held in honour of his memory."

The sirname is in large capital letters; the _year_ is indistinctly
written. This is the note which is indicated in the auction-catalogue of
the library of Mr. Boswell, No. 2229.

BOLTON CORNEY.

* * * * *

Minor Notes.

_Egg and Arrow Ornament._--Mr. Ruskin, in his _Stones of Venice_, vol. i.
p. 305., says--

"The Greek egg and arrow cornice is a nonsense cornice, very noble in
its lines, but utterly absurd in its meaning. Arrows have had nothing
to do with eggs (at least since Leda's time), neither are the so-called
arrows like arrows, nor the eggs like eggs, nor the honeysuckles like
honeysuckles: they are all conventionalized into a monotonous
successiveness of nothing--pleasant to the eye, useless to the
thought."

The ornament of which Mr. R. thus speaks is indifferently called egg and
tongue, egg and dart, as well as egg and arrow. It seems to me that the
_egg_ is a complete misnomer, although common to all the designations; and
I fancy that the idea of what is so called was originally derived from the
full-length shield, and therefore that the ornament should be named the
_shield and dart_, an association more reasonable than is suggested by any
of the ordinary appellations. Can any of {350} your correspondents offer
any confirmation of this?

B. J.

Liverpool, March 31. 1851.

_Defoe's Project for purifying the English Language._--Among the many
schemes propounded by De Foe, in his _Essay upon Projects_, published in
1696, there is one which still remains a theory, although eminently
practicable, and well worthy of consideration.

He conceived that there might be an academy or society formed for the
purpose of correcting, purifying, and establishing the English language,
such as had been founded in France under Cardinal Richelieu.

"The work of this society," says Defoe, "should be to encourage polite
learning, to polish and refine the English tongue, and advance the so
much neglected faculty of correct language; also, to establish purity
and propriety of style, and to purge it from all the irregular
additions that ignorance and affectation have introduced; and all these
innovations of speech, if I may call them such, which some dogmatic
writers have the confidence to foster upon their native language, as if
their authority were sufficient to make their own fancy legitimate."

Never was such society more needed than in the present day, when you can
scarcely take up a newspaper, or a periodical, a new poem, or any modern
literary production, without finding some new-coined word, perplexing to
the present reader, and a perfect stumbling-block in the way of any future
editor.

Some of these words are, I admit, a welcome addition to our common stock,
but the greater part of them are mere abortions, having no analogy to any
given root.

A society similar to the one proposed by Defoe might soon be established in
this country, if a few such efficient authorities as Dr. Kennedy would take
the initiative in the movement.

He who should first establish such a society, and bring it to a practicable
bearing, would be conferring an inestimable boon on society.

I trust that these hints may serve to arouse the attention of some of the
many talented contributors to the "NOTES AND QUERIES," and in due season
bring forth fruit.

DAVID STEVENS.

Godalming, April 19. 1851.

_Great Fire of London_.--Our popular histories of England, generally,
contain very indefinite statements respecting the extent of destruction
wrought upon the city of London by the Great Fire. I have therefore thought
it may be interesting to others, as it has been to myself, to peruse the
following, which purports to be "extracted from the Certificates of the
Surveyors soon after appointed to survey the Ruins."

"That the fire that began in London upon the second of September, 1666,
at one Mr. Farryner's house, a baker in Pudding Lane, between the hours
of one and two in the morning, and continued burning until the sixth of
that month, did overrun the space of three hundred and seventy-three
acres within the walls of the city of London, and sixty-three acres
three roods without the walls. There remained seventy-five acres three
roods standing within the walls unburnt. Eighty-nine parish churches,
besides chappels burnt. Eleven parishes within the walls standing.
Houses burnt, Thirteen thousand two hundred.

"JONAS MOORE, }
"RALPH GATRIX, } Surveyors."

I copy this from a volume of tracts, printed 1679 to 1681; chiefly
"Narratives" of judicial and other proceedings relating to the (so called)
"Popish Plots" in the reign of Charles II.

WM. FRANKS MATHEWS.

_Noble or Workhouse Names_--

"The only three noble names in the county were to be found in the great
house [workhouse]; mine [Berners] was one, the other two were Devereux
and Bohun."--_Lavengro_, iii. 232.

The above extract reminds me of a list of names of the poor about St.
Alban's, which I forwarded some months since, viz. Brax, Brandon, De Amer,
De Ayton, Fitzgerald, Fitz John, Gascoigne, Harcourt, Howard, Lacey,
Stanley, Ratcliffe.

A. C.

* * * * *

Queries.

PASSAGES IN THE NEW TESTAMENT ILLUSTRATED FROM DEMOSTHENES.

Acts xvii. 21.:

"For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time
in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing."

Can any of your biblical correspondents inform me in what commentary upon
the New Testament the coincidence with the following passages in
Demosthenes is noticed, or whether any other source of the historical fact
has been recorded? In the translation of Petrus Lagnerius, Franc. 1610 (I
have not at hand the entire works), we find these words:

"Nihil est omnium, Athenienses, in præsentiâ nocentius, quam quod vos
alienati estis a rebus, et tantisper operam datis, dum audientes
sedetis, si quid Novi nuntiatum fuerit" (4. contr. _Phil_.).

Again:

"Nos vero, dicetur verum, nihil facientes, hic perpetuo sedemus
cunctabundi, tum decernentes, tum interrogantes, si quid Novi in foro
dicatur."--4 _Orat. ad Philipp. Epist._

Pricæus, in his very learned and valuable _Commentarii in varios N.T.
Libros_, Lond. 1660, fol., at p. 628, in v. 21., says only--

"Videantur quæ ex Demosthene, Plutarcho, aliis, _Eruditi_ annotarunt."

{351}

Matthew xiii. 14.:

"And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By
hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall
see, and shall not perceive."

This proverb seems to have been common to all ages and countries. It is of
frequent occurrence in the New Testament (Mark iv. 12.; viii. 18.; John
xii. 40.; Acts xxviii. 25.; Romans xi. 8.), and, as in Matthew, is referred
to Isaiah. But, in the Old Testament, there is earlier authority for its
use in Deuteronomy xxix. 4. It occurs also in Jeremiah v. 21.; in Ezekiel
xii. 2., and, with a somewhat different application, in the Psalms, cxv.
5.; cxxxv. 16.

That it was employed as an established proverb by Demosthenes seems to have
been generally overlooked. He says:

[Greek: Hoi men houtôs horôntes ta tôn êtuchêkotôn erga, hôste totês
paroimias, horôntes mê horan, kai akouontas mê akouein. (Kata
Aristogeitonos,] A Taylor, Cantab. vol. ii. pp. 494-5.)

It is quoted, however, by Pricæus (p. 97.), who also supplies exactly
corresponding passages from Maximus Tyrius (A.D. 190), Plutarch (A.D.
107-20), and Philo (A.D. 41). Of these, the last only can have been prior
to the publication of St. Matthew's Gospel, which Saxius places, at the
earliest, in the reign of Claudius.

Hugo Grotius has no reference to Demosthenes in his _Annotationes in Vet.
Test.,_ Vogel & Doderein, 1776; but cites Heraclitus the Ephesian, who,
according to Saxius, flourished in the year 502 B.C., and Aristides, who,
on the same authority, lived in the 126th year of the Christian era. Has
any other commentator besides Pricæus alluded to the passage in
Demosthenes?

C. H. P.

Brighton, April 21.

* * * * *

THE HOUSE OF MAILLÉ.

The house of Maillé (vide Lord Mahon's _Life of Condé_) contributed to the
Crusades one of its bravest champions. Can any of your numerous
contributors give me information as to the name and achievements of the
Crusader?

Claire Clémence de Maillé, daughter of the Maréchal Duke de Brezé, and
niece of Richelieu, was married in 1641 to the Duc d'Enghien, afterwards
the Great Condé; and Lord Mahon, somewhere in his life of the hero, makes
mention of the princess as the "last of her family."

Claire Clémence had an only brother, who held the exalted post of High
Admiral of France, and in 1646 he commanded a French fleet which
disembarked 8000 men in the marshes of Sienna, and himself shortly
afterwards fell at the siege of Orbitello. The admiral having died
unmarried, the Brezé estates became the property of the princess, who
transmitted them to her descendants, the last of whom was the unfortunate
Duc d'Enghien, who perished at Vincennes.

Thus much is patent; but I think it probable his lordship was not aware
that a branch of the family was exiled, and with the La Touches, La
Bertouches, &c., settled in the sister kingdom, most likely at the
Revocation of the Edict of Nantes. Their descendants subsequently passed
over into this country, and have contributed to the lists of the legal and
medical professions. Up to the present century a gentleman bearing the
slightly altered name of Mallié held a commission in the British army. Even
now, the family is not extinct, and the writer being lately on a visit to a
lady, probably the sole representative _in name_ of this once powerful
house, noticed in her possession a series of four small engravings,
representing the Great Condé; his mother, a princess of Montmorency,
pronounced to be the "handsomest woman in Europe;" the old Maréchal de
Maillé Brezé; and his daughter, Claire Clémence.

Our _Pall Mall_ is, I believe, derived from _Pailée Maillé_, a game
somewhat analogous to cricket, and imported from France in the reign of the
second Charles: it was formerly played in St. James's Park, and in the
exercise of the sport a small hammer or _mallet_ was used to strike the
ball. I think it worth noting that the _Mallié_ crest _is_ a mailed arm and
hand, the latter grasping a _mallet_.

Be it understood that the writer has no pretensions to a knowledge of
heraldic terms and devices; so, without pinning any argument on the
coincidence, he thought it not without interest. He is aware that the mere
fact of a similarity between surnames and crests is not without its
parallel in English families.

A NEW SUBSCRIBER.

Birmingham, April 22. 1851.

* * * * *

Minor Queries.

_Meaning of "eign."_--What is the meaning of the word "eign" in Presteign,
also the name of a street and a brook? Is it connected with the Anglo-Saxon
_thegen_ or _theign?_

H. C. K.

Hereford.

_The Bonny Cravat._--Can any of your readers give a probable explanation of
the meaning of the sign of an inn at Woodchurch, in Kent, which is "The
Bonny Cravat," now symbolised as a huge white neckcloth, with a "waterfall"
tie?

E. H. Y.

_What was the Day of the Accession of Richard III.?_--Sir Harris Nicolas,
in his _Chronology of History_ (2nd edition, p. 326.) decides for June 26,
1433, giving strong reasons for such opinion. But his primary reason,
founded on a fac-simile extract from the Memoranda Rolls in the office of
the King's Remembrancer in the Exchequer of {352} Ireland, printed, with
fac-simile, in the second _Report of the Commissioners on Irish Records_,
1812, p. 160., gives rise to a doubt; for, as Sir Harris Colas states,

"It is remarkable that the printed copy should differ from the
fac-simile in the identical point which caused the letter to be
published, for in the former the 'xxvij^{th} of June' occurs, whereas
in the fac-simile it is the 'xxvj^{th} of June.' The latter is
doubtless correct; for an engraver, who copies precisely what is before
him, is less likely to err than a transcriber or editor."

This is most probably the case; but perhaps some of your correspondents in
Ireland will settle the point accurately.

J. E.

_Lucas Family._--Can any of your correspondents inform me what were the
names of the sons of John Lucas, of Weston, co. Suffolk, who lived at the
end of the fifteenth and beginning of the sixteenth century? One of them,
Thomas, was Solicitor-General, and a Privy Councillor, to Henry VII., and
had estates in Suffolk.

W. L.

_Watch of Richard Whiting._--In Warner's _History of Glastonbury_ mention
is made of the watch of Richard Whiting, the last abbot. It is stated in
the _Gentleman's Magazine_ of 1805 to have been in the possession of the
Rev. Mr. Bowen, of Bath. Since then, I think, it was sold by auction; at
least I have heard so. Perhaps some of your readers know what has become of
it, and can say where it now is. The name "Richard Whiting" is said to be
engraved inside it.

C. O. S. M.

_Laurence Howel, the Original Pilgrim._--The unfortunate Laurence Howel
published in 1717 (the year in which he was committed to Newgate) a little
volume, entitled _Desiderius; or, the Original Pilgrim, a Divine Dialogue,
showing the most compendious Way to arrive at the Love of God. Rendered
into English, and explained, with Notes._ By Laurence Howel, A.M. London;
printed by William Redmayne, for the Author, 1717. In the preface he tells
us, that the work was originally written in Spanish; afterwards translated
into Italian, French, High-Dutch and Low-Dutch, and about the year 1587
into Latin from the High-Dutch, by Laurentius Surius. There were
subsequently two more Latin versions: one by Vander Meer, from the French
and Dutch copies, compared with the original; and another by Antonius
Boetzer in 1617. The author's name, he says, was unknown to all the
editors, and the several editions had different titles; by some it was
called the _Treasure of Devotion_, by others the _Compendious Way to
Salvation_. The last, however (Boetzer's, I presume), bears that of
_Desiderius_. As this was the author's title, Mr. Howel adopted it for his
translation, adding, he says, that of the _Original Pilgrim_, to
distinguish it from others of the same name, or very like it. He there
informs us that Mr. Royston (the distinguished publisher in Charles II.'s
and James II.'s reigns) had declared that Bishop Patrick took his _Parable
of the Pilgrim_ from it, and that it had formed the ground-work of the
writings of many authors in that style.

Can any of your readers give me the titles of the editions in Spanish, or
any language, of this interesting little book? I should be much obliged for
any information regarding it. Is Howel's little translation scarce? Has the
authorship of the original ever been hinted at?

RICHARD HOOPER.

University Club, March 22. 1851.

_The Churchwardens' Accounts, &c., of St. Mary-de-Castro,
Leicester._--Nichols, in his _History of Leicestershire_, has given
numerous extracts from the accounts of this ancient collegiate
establishment (founded in 1107), and also from a book relating to the
religious guild of The Trinity connected with the church. All these
documents have now, however, entirely disappeared,--how, or at what period
since the publication of the work, is unknown; but I find by a
newspaper-cutting in my possession (unfortunately without date or
auctioneer's name), that a very large collection of ancient documents,
filling several boxes, and relating to this church and others in the
county, was sold by auction in London some years ago, probably between the
years 1825 and 1830. I shall feel obliged if any of your correspondents can
inform me in whose possession they now are, and if they can be consulted.

LEICESTRENSIS.

_Aristotle and Pythagoras._--What reason (if any) is there for supposing
that Aristotle derived his philosophy from Pythagoras himself?

D. K.

_When Deans first styled Very Reverend._--Can any of your correspondents
state at what period Deans of Cathedrals were first designated as "Very
Reverend?" Forty years ago they prayed at Christ Church, Oxford, for the
Reverend the Deans, the Canons, &c. The inscription on the stone covering
the remains of Sir Richard Kaye, Bart., Dean of Lincoln, who died in 1809,
terms him "the Reverend."

X. X.

_Form of Prayer at the Healing_ (Vol. iii., pp. 42. 93. 148.).--As my note
on this subject has been misunderstood, I would prefer this Query. What is
the earliest edition of the Prayer Book in which the Form for the Healing
appears? Mr. Lathbury states 1709, which is I believe the generally
received date; but it is found in one printed in London in 1707 immediately
before the Articles. Its appearance in the Prayer Book is entirely
unauthorised; and it would be curious to ascertain also, whether it found a
place in the Prayer Books printed at Oxford or Cambridge.

N. E. R. (a Subscriber).

{353}

_West Chester._--In maps of Cheshire, 1670, and perhaps later, the city of
Chester is thus called. Why is it so designated? It does not appear to be
so called now. Passing through a village only six miles from London last
week, I heard a mother saying to a child, "If you are not a good girl I
will send you to West Chester." "Go to Bath" is common enough; but why
should either of these places be singled out? The Cheshire threat seems to
have been in use for some time, unless that city is still called West
Chester.

JOHN FRANCIS X.

_The Milesians._--With respect to the origin of the Milesian race little
seems to be known, even by antiquaries who have given their attention to
the archæology of Ireland, the inhabitants of which country are reputed to
have been of Milesian origin. The Milesian race, also, is thought to have
come over from Spain, a conjecture which is rather confirmed by the
etymology of the names of some Irish towns, where the letters _gh_, as in
Drogheda and Aghada, if so convertible, have the same pronunciation as the
Spanish _j_ in Aranjuez and Badajoz, and also by the expression and cast of
features marked in many of the peasants of the south-west of Ireland, which
strikingly resemble those of the children of Spain.

There is also another subject of antiquity in Ireland, and closely
connected with her early history, of the true origin of which the world
seems much in ignorance, viz. her Round Towers. Possibly some of your able
correspondents will kindly supply some information on one or both of these
subjects.

W. R. M.

_Round Robbin._--In Dr. Heylin's controversy with Fuller on his Church
History, the following quotation[1] occurs:

"That the Sacrament of the Altar is nothing else but a piece of bread,
or a little _predie round robbin_."

In the East Riding of Yorkshire the term is designative of a petition, in
which all the names are signed radiating from a centre, so as to render it
impossible to discover who was the first to sign it. What is the derivation
of it?

R. W. E.

Cor. Chr. Coll., Cambridge.

[Footnote 1: _Appeal of Injured Innocence_, p. 462.]

_Experto crede Roberto._--What is the origin of this saying?

N. B.

_Captain Howe._--

Captain Howe, the King's (George II.) nephew by an illegitimate
source."--_Pictorial History of England_, iv. 597.

Can you inform me how this captain was thus related to George II.?

F. B. RELTON.

_Bactria._--Can you refer me to a work worthy the name of _The History of
Bactria_, or to detached information concerning Bactriana, under the
Scythian kings? I also want a guide to the Græco-Bactrian series of coins.

BLOWEN.

* * * * *

Replies.

THE FAMILY OF THE TRADESCANTS.

(Vol. ii., pp. 119. 286.)

The family of the Tradescants is involved in considerable obscurity, and
the period of the arrival of the first of that name in England is not, for
a certainty, known. There were, it seems, three of the Tradescants at one
time in this country--grandfather, father, and son. John Tradescant (or
Tradeskin, as he was generally called by his contemporaries) the elder was,
according to Anthony Wood, a Fleming or a Dutchman. He probably came to
England about the latter end of the reign of Elizabeth, or in the beginning
of that of James the First. He is reported to have been a great traveller,
and to have previously visited Barbary, Greece, Egypt, and other Eastern
countries. Upon his first arrival here he is said to have been successively
gardener to the Lord Treasurer Salisbury, Lord Weston, the Duke of
Buckingham, and other noblemen of distinction. In these situations he
remained until the office of royal gardener was bestowed upon him in 1629.

To John Tradescant the elder, posterity is mainly indebted for the
introduction of botany in this kingdom. "He, by great industry, made it
manifest that there is scarcely any plant existing in the known world, that
will not, with proper care, thrive in our climate." In a visit made by Sir
W. Watson and Dr. Mitchell to Tradescant's garden in 1749, an account of
which is inserted in the _Philosophical Transactions_, vol. xlvi. p. 160.,
it appears that it had been many years totally neglected, and the house
belonging to it empty and ruined; but though the garden was quite covered
with weeds, there remained among them manifest footsteps of its founder.
They found there the _Borago latifolia sempervivens_ of Caspar Bauhine;
_Polygonatum vulgare latifolium_, C.B.; _Aristolochia clematitis recta_,
C.B.; and the _Dracontium_ of Dodoens. There were then remaining two trees
of the _Arbutus_, which from their being so long used to our winters, did
not suffer from the severe cold of 1739-40, when most of their kind were
killed in England. In the orchard there was a tree of the _Rhamnus
catharticus_, about twenty feet high, and nearly a foot in diameter. There
are at present no traces of this garden remaining.

In the Ashmolean Library is preserved (No. 1461.) a folio manuscript
(probably in the handwriting of the elder Tradescant) which purports to be
"The Tradescants' Orchard, illustrated in sixty-five coloured drawings of
fruits, exhibiting various kinds of the apple, cherry, damson, date, {354}
gooseberry, peares, peaches, plums, nectarines, grape, Hasell-nutt, quince,
strawberry, with the times of their ripening."

Old John Tradescant died in the year 1652, at which period he was probably
far advanced in years, leaving behind him a son (also of the same name) who
seems to have inherited his father's talents and enthusiasm. There is a
tradition that John Tradescant the younger entered himself on board a
privateer going against the Algerines, that he might have an opportunity of
bringing apricot-trees from that country. He is known to have taken a
voyage to Virginia, whence he returned with many new plants. The two
Tradescants were the means of introducing a variety of curious species into
this kingdom, several of which bore their name. Tradescants' _Spiderwort_
and _Aster_ are well known to this day, and Linnæus has immortalised them
among the botanists by making a new genus under their names of the
_Spiderwort_, which had been before called _Ephemeron_.

When the elder Tradescant first settled in England, he formed a curious
collection of natural history, coins, medals, and a great variety of
"uncommon rarities." A catalogue of them was published in 12mo. in the year
1656, by his son, under the name of _Museum Tradescantianum_; to which are
prefixed portraits, both of the father and son, by Hollar. This Museum or
"Ark," as it was termed, was frequently visited by persons of rank, who
became benefactors thereto; among these were Charles the First, Henrietta
Maria (his queen), Archbishop Laud, George Duke of Buckingham, Robert and
William Cecil, Earls of Salisbury, and many other persons of distinction:
among them also appears the philosophic John Evelyn, who in his _Diary_ has
the following notice:

"Sept. 17, 1657, I went to see Sir Robert Needham, at Lambeth, a
relation of mine, and thence to John Tradescant's museum."

"Thus John Tradeskin starves our wondering eyes
By boxing up his new-found rarities."

Ashmole, in his _Diary_ (first published by Charles Burman in 1717), has
three significant entries relating to the subject of our notice, which I
transcribe _verbatim_:

"Decem. 12, 1659. Mr. Tredescant and his wife told me they had been
long considering upon whom to bestow their closet of curiosities when
they died, and at last had resolved to give it unto me.

"April 22, 1662. Mr. John Tredescant died.

"May 30, 1662. This Easter term I preferred a bill in Chancery against
Mrs. Tredescant, for the rarities her husband had settled on me."

The success of Ashmole's suit is well known; but the whole transaction
reflects anything but honour upon his name. The loss of her husband's
treasures probably preyed upon the mind of Mrs. Tradescant; for in the
_Diary_ before quoted, under April 4, 1678, Ashmole says:

"My wife told me that Mrs. Tradescant was found drowned in her pond.
She was drowned the day before at noon, as appears by some
circumstance."

This was the same Hesther Tradescant who erected the Tradescant monument in
Lambeth churchyard. She was buried in the vault where her husband and his
son John (who "died in his spring") had been formerly laid.

The table monument to the memory of the Tradescants was erected in 1662.
The sculptures on the four sides are as follows, viz. on the _north_, a
crocodile, shells, &c., and a view of some Egyptian buildings; on the
_south_, broken columns, Corinthian capitals, &c., supposed to be ruins in
Greece, or some Eastern country; on the _east_, Tradescant's arms, on a
bend three fleurs-de-lys, impaling a lion passant; on the _west_, a hydra,
and under it a skull; various figures of trees, &c., in relievo, adorn the
four corners of the tomb; over it is placed a handsome tablet of black
marble. The monument, by the contribution of some friends to their memory,
was in the year 1773 repaired, and (according to Sir John Hawkins) the
following lines, "_formerly_ intended for an epitaph, inserted thereon."
Other authorities say that they were merely _restored_.

"Know, stranger, ere thou pass beneath this stone,
Lye John Tradescant, grandsire, father, son;
The last dy'd in his spring; the other two
Liv'd till they had travell'd Art and Nature through,
As by their choice collections may appear,
Of what is rare, in land, in sea, in air;
Whilst they (as Homer's _Iliad_ in a nut)
A world of wonders in one closet shut;
These famous antiquarians that had been
_Both Gardeners to the Rose and Lily Queen_,
Transplanted now themselves, sleep here; and when
Angels shall with their trumpets waken men,
And fire shall purge the world, these hence shall rise,
And change this garden for a Paradise."

A number of important errors concerning this once celebrated family have
been made by different writers. Sir John Hawkins, in a note to his edition
of Walton's _Angler_ (edit. 1792, p. 24.), says:

"There were, it seems, three of the Tradescants, grandfather, father,
and son: the son is the person here meant: the two former were
gardeners to Queen Elizabeth, and the latter to King Charles I."

The epitaph above quoted satisfactorily proves, I think, that the
Tradescants were never gardeners to the maiden Queen. "The rose and lily
queen" was certainly Henrietta Maria, the queen of Charles the First. I
have now before me (from the cabinet of a friend) a small silver medal
struck to commemorate the marriage of Charles the First. It has on the
obverse the busts of Charles and Henrietta, the sun shining from the clouds
above {355} them: the inscription is CH: MAG: ET: HEN: MA: BRIT: REX: ET:
REG. The reverse contains in the field, Cupid mixing _lilies with roses_;
the legend being FVNDIT: AMOR: LILIA: MIXTA: ROSIS. In the exergue is the
date 1625. The Tradescant mentioned by Walton in 1653 was the _second_ of
that name, not the son, as stated by Sir John Hawkins.

The editor of the last edition of Evelyn's _Diary_ (vol. ii. p. 414.) says,
speaking of the Tradescants:

"They were all eminent gardeners, travellers, and collectors of
curiosities. The two first came into this country in the reign of James
I., and the second and third were employed in the Royal Gardens by
Charles I."

Here is a _positive_ statement that the elder Tradescant and his son came
into England in the reign of _James I._ But there is no _proof_ of this
given. It is merely the writer's assertion. At the end of the same note,
speaking of Tradescant's Ark, the editor observes:

"It formed the foundation of the Ashmolean Museum at Oxford, and a
catalogue of its contents was printed by the youngest John Tradescant
in 1656, with the title of _Museum Tradescantianum_. He died in 1652."

It was not the _youngest_ John Tradescant that died in 1652, but the
_oldest_, the _grandfather_--the first of that name that settled in
England.

The following is a list of the portraits of the Tradescant family now in
the Ashmolean Museum; both father and son are in these portraits called
_Sir_ John, though it does not appear that either of them was ever
knighted. Mr. Black, in his excellent catalogue of the Ashmolean Library,
also calls the elder Tradescant _Sir_ John. (See p. 1266.)

1. Sir John Tradescant, sen., three-quarter size, ornamented with fruit,
flowers, and garden roots.

2. The same, after his decease.

3. The same, a small three-quarter piece, in water colours.

4. A large painting of his wife, son, and daughter, quarter-length.

5. Sir John Tradescant, junior, in his garden, with a spade in his hand,
half-length.

6. The same with his wife, half-length.

7. The same, with his friend Zythepsa of Lambeth, a collection of shells,
&c. upon a table before them.

8. A large quarter piece inscribed Sir John Tradescant's second wife and
son.

Granger says he saw a picture at a gentleman's house in Wiltshire, which
was not unlike that of the deceased Tradescant, and the inscription was
applicable to it:

"Mortuus haud alio quam quo pater ore quiesti,
Quam facili frueris nunc quoque nocte doces."

I may add, in conclusion, that several beautiful drawings of the Tradescant
monument in Lambeth churchyard are preserved in the Pepysian library. These
drawings were engraved for the _Philosophical Transactions_, vol. lxiii. p.
88.; and are printed from the same plates in the _Bibliotheca Topographica
Britannica_, vol. ii.

EDWARD F. RIMBAULT.

* * * * *

MEANING OF VENVILLE.

(Vol. iii., pp. 152. 310.)

I observe, in p. 310. of the present volume, that two correspondents, P.
and K., have contributed conjectures as to the meaning and origin of the
term _venville_, noticed and explained _antè_, p. 152. The _origin_ of the
word is of course to some extent open to conjecture; but they may rest
assured that the _meaning_ of it is not, nor ever has been, within the
domain of mere conjecture with those who have had any opportunities of
inquiry in the proper quarter. The term has not the slightest reference to
the ceremony of delivering possession, which P. has evidently witnessed in
the case of his father, and which lawyers call livery of seisin; nor is
there on Dartmoor any such word as _ven_ signifying peat, or as _fail_,
signifying turf. No doubt a fen on the moor would probably contain "black
earth or peat," like most other mountain bogs; and if (as K. says) _fail_
means a "turf or flat clod" in Scotland, I think it probable that a
Scotchman on Dartmoor might now and then so far forget himself as to call
peat or turf by a name which would certainly not be understood by an
aboriginal Devonian. The local name of the peat or other turf cut for fuel
is _vaggs_, and this has perhaps been confounded in the recollection of
K.'s informant with _ven_. At all events, I can assure both P. and K. (who,
I presume, are not familiar with the district) that the tenants of venville
lands have no functions to perform, as such, in any degree connected with
either turf-cutting, or "fenging fields," and that they do not necessarily,
or generally, occupy peat districts, or rejoice in

"All the infections that the sun sucks up
From bogs, fens, flats," &c.;

but, on the contrary, they are the owners of some of the most valuable,
salubrious, and picturesque purlieus of the forest. With regard to the name
"fengfield," although I am pretty familiar with the records of the forest
extant for the last five hundred years past, I do not remember that it is
ever so named or spelt in the muniments of the manor or forest. It is so
written by Risdon, and in some few other documents entitled to little
weight, and from which no safe inference can be drawn. Whatever be the
etymological origin of the term, it should be assumed as indisputable by
any one who may hereafter exercise his ingenuity or his fancy upon it, that
the four most prominent {356} incidents to the tenure are--1. payment of
fines; 2. situation in an ancient vill; 3. attendance on the lord's court;
4. enjoyment of certain rights of common. It may be that neither the _fine_
nor the _vill_ forms a component part of the name; but K. need have no
scruple in believing that an abbreviated Latin or "legal term" (invented,
of course, by the stewards or bailiffs of the lord) may have become
naturalised among those of the inhabitants of the Moor whom it concerns.
The tenants or retainers of a manor have no alternative but to submit to
any generic name by which the steward may please to distinguish them. Thus
the "priors" and "censors" of Dartmoor forest are content to be called by
those names, because they were designated as "prehurdarii" and "censarii"
in the court rolls some hundred years ago. The tenants of a certain
lordship in Cornwall know and convey their tenements by the name of
_landams_ to this day, merely because the stewards two hundred years ago,
when the court rolls were in Latin, well knowing that _landa_ was the Latin
for _land_, and that transitive verbs in that language require an
accusative case, recorded each tenant as having taken of the lord "unam
landam, vocatam Tregollup," &c. Indeed so easily does a clipt exotic take
root and become acclimated among the peasantry of the Moor, whose powers of
appropriation are so much disparaged by the sceptical doubts of K., that
since the establishment of local courts the terms _fifa_ and _casa_ have
become familiar to them as household words and the name and uses of that
article of abbreviated Latinity called a '_bus_ are, as I am credibly
informed, not unknown to them.

E. SMIRKE.

* * * * *

Replies to Minor Queries.

_Newburgh Hamilton_ (Vol. iii, p. 117).--In Thomas Whincop's _List of
Dramatic Authors_, &c., the following notice of Hamilton occurs:--

"Mr. Newburgh Hamilton.

A Gentleman, who I think was related to, at least lived in the family
of Duke _Hamilton_; he wrote two Plays, called

I. _The Doating Lovers_, or _The Libertine Tam'd_; a Comedy acted at
the Theatre in _Lincoln's Inn_-_Fields_, in the year 1715, with no
success: but supported to the third night, for the Author's Benefit;
when the Boxes and Pit were laid together at the unusual Price of six
Shillings each Ticket.

II. _The Petticoat Plotter_; a Comedy of two Acts, performed at the
Theatre Royal in _Drury-Lane_."

T. C. T.

_Pedigree of Owen Glendower_ (Vol. iii., p. 222.).--A contributor who is
not a Cambrian, sends the following pedigree of Owen Glyndowr, with the
authority from whence he has obtained it, viz. Harl. MS. 807., Robert
Glover's Book of Pedigrees and Arms, drawn up in part about 1574.

H. E.

JOHANNIS SCUDAMORE, miles,
duxit filiam et hæredam
Oweni Glendoure proditoris
Regis H. 4.

{357}

_Mind your P's and Q's_ (Vol. iii., p. 328.)--This expression arose from
the ancient custom of hanging a slate behind the alehouse door, on which
was written P. or Q. (i. e. _Pint_ or _Quart_) against the name of each
customer, according to the quantity which he had drunk, and which was not
expected to be paid for till the Saturday evening, when the wages were
settled.

The expression so familiar to schoolboys of "_going tick_," may perhaps be
traced to this, a _tick_ or mark being put for every glass of ale.

C. DE LA PRYME.

_The Sempecta at Croyland_ (Vol. iii., p. 328.).--He was not there,
however; and I am sorry to say, I do not remember where he was personally,
or exactly where the account of him is to be found. I have no doubt of its
being in one or other of the fourteen volumes of Martene's _Thesaurus et
Amplissima Collectio_. I do not now possess those books, and have not
access to them; but I think your correspondent will find what he wants
without much difficulty if (as I suspect) it is with some other pieces in
rhyme, and therefore likely to catch the eye in turning over a volume
chiefly in prose. Perhaps the name "Francis" may be in the index. If he
does not, I shall be happy to seek for information.

S. R. MAITLAND.

Gloucester.

_Solid-hoofed Pigs_ (Vol. iii., p. 263.).--I saw a pig of this kind a few
years ago, in possession of Sir William Homan, Bart., of Dromroe, near
Cappoquin, in the county of Waterford.

I do not know whether he has any of that breed at present; but have little
doubt that a note, addressed to Sir William on the subject, would receive a
courteous reply.

H. C.

Thurles, April 9. 1851.

_Porci solide-pedes_ (Vol. iii., p. 263.).--A correspondent of "NOTES AND
QUERIES" inquires about the breed of solid-hoofed pigs. Some years, perhaps
twenty years, ago there were several pigs of that sort in the possession of
Robert Ramsden, Esq., of Coulton Hall, Notts, of which he was good enough
to give some to my father. I believe they were considered of Chinese
origins, but how remotely I do not know. They were very easily fattened,
but always of small size; and I think, unless my memory much deceives me,
on removing the horny portion of the hoof, the rudiments of a cloven hoof,
like that of the ordinary swine, were to be seen.

E. G. SELWYN.

Blackheath, April 17. 1851.

_Sir Henry Slingsby's Diary_ (Vol. iii., p. 323.).--The council of "THE
CAMDEN SOCIETY" will no doubt be pleased to find that your correspondents
are good enough to keep in view the welfare of that Society, and to suggest
works suitable for their publication.

If Sir Henry Slingsby's _Diary_ had never been published, it would indeed
have been an excellent book for the Camden Society; but be kind enough to
inform your correspondent P. B. that, besides some quotations printed in
Seward's _Anecdotes_, and large extracts published at Edinburgh, in an
octavo volume, in 1806, the whole _Diary_, with a great deal of
illustrative matter relating to the Slingsby family, was published in one
volume, 8vo., London, 1836, under the very competent editorship of the Rev.
Daniel Parsons, of Oriel College, Oxford.

It appears from the preface to that publication, that the original MS. is
not now known to be in existence. Mr. Parsons printed from a copy of the
original, made by Sir Savile Slingsby, in 1714-5, which then remained at
Scriven.

ETTIE.

_Criston, Somerset_ (Vol. iii., p. 278.).--Perhaps PRISTON is the place
inquired for. This is a village near Keynshem, where a Mr. _Vaughan_
Jenkins has some property. _Criston_, as a place in Somerset, is unknown to

Bath, April 18.

_Criston_ (Vol. iii., p. 278.).--There is a small village in Somersetshire
called Christon, about five miles N.W. of Axbridge.

C. I. R.

_Tradesmen's Signs_ (Vol. iii., p. 224.).--In the delightful little volume
on Chaucer, in Knight's shilling series, entitled _Pictures of English
Life_, the author has the following on the Tabard, at p. 19.:--

"The sign and its supports were removed in 1776, when all such
characteristic features of the streets of London in the olden time,
disappeared _in obedience to a parliamentary edict_ for their
destruction."

It would appear, however, by the subsequent quotation from Brand's
_Antiquities_, vol. ii. p. 359., that the edict above referred to was not
carried into execution against all signs; or that, if so, it was soon
repealed:--

"Lord Thurlow, in his speech for postponing the further reading of the
Surgeons' Incorporation Bill, July 17th, 1797, stated 'that by a
statute still in force, the barbers and surgeons were each to use a
pole.'"

R. W. E.

Cor. Chr. Coll., Cambridge.

_Emendation of a Passage in Virgil_ (Vol. iii., p. 237.).--The emendation
of SCRIBLERUS is certainly objectionable, and by no means satisfactory, for
these reasons:--1st. "Ac sunt in spatio" is by no means elegant Latin,
which "addunt se in spatia" is; for the word "addunt" is constantly used in
the same way elsewhere.

2nd. The word "spatium" is seldom used to signify a chariot course.

"Spatia," the plural, was the proper expression, and is only so deviated
from in poetry in a single instance. (Juv. _Sat._ vi. 582.) It is used in
{358} the plural in Virg. _Æn_. v. 316. 325. 327.; Statius, _Theb._ vi.
594.; Horace, _Epist._ 1. xiv. 9.

_Vide_ Smith's _Dictionary of Antiquities_, under art. Circus, p. 232.

Surely there is nothing unintelligible in the expression, "addunt se in
spatia," which is the reading given in almost all the best editions.

J. E. M.

* * * * *

Miscellaneous.

NOTES ON BOOKS, SALES, CATALOGUES, ETC.

Archdeacon Cotton, whose endeavours to ascertain and record the succession
of the Prelates and Members of the Cathedral Bodies in Ireland are probably
known to many of our readers (at least, by the Queries which have appeared
in our Columns), has just completed his _Fasti Ecclesiæ Hiberniæ_, in 4
vols. 8vo. From the nature of the work, it is obvious that it could never
have been undertaken with a view to profit. The printing, &c., has cost
upwards of six hundred pounds, and the Archdeacon, naturally unwilling to
lose the whole of this outlay, is circulating a prospectus offering copies
at fifty shillings the set. Of these, there are but two hundred. The
utility of a book which contains the names and preferments of every
occupant of an Irish see, dignity, or prebend, from the earliest period to
the present day, so far as existing materials permits, is so obvious, that
it can scarcely be doubted that it must eventually find a place in all
public and official libraries.

CATALOGUES RECEIVED.--J. Miller's (43. Chandos Street) Catalogue No. XXII.
of Books Old and New; D. Nutt's (270. Strand) List of Valuable Books,
Foreign Theology, Canon Law, Monastic History, Fathers of the Church, &c.;
Nattali and Bond's (23. Bedford Street, Covent Garden) Catalogue of Ancient
and Modern Books in all Languages; W. Heath's (29½. Lincoln's Inn Fields)
Catalogue No. III. for 1851, of Valuable Second-hand Books in all classes
of Literature; T. D. Thomson's (13. Upper King Street, Russell Square)
Catalogue Part XIV. of Second-hand Books English and Foreign; J. Tupling's
(320. Strand) Catalogue of Books on Divinity, so classified as to form a
guide to Students in their choice; J. Lilly's (7. Pall Mall) Catalogue No.
III. of Valuable Books relating to English History, Antiquities, &c.; Olive
Lasbury's (10. Park Street, Bristol) Catalogue No. XI. of Books now on
Sale; J. Petheram's (94. High Holborn) Catalogue Part CXXII. of Books Old
and New; W. S. Lincoln's (Cheltenham House, Westminster Road) Catalogue No.
LXVIII. of Cheap Second-hand Books.

* * * * *

BOOKS AND ODD VOLUMES WANTED TO PURCHASE.

HISTORY OF JENNY SPINNER, THE HERTFORDSHIRE GIRL, written by herself.
London. 18 mo. J. Wheble, Warwick Square. 1800.

ANTI-JACOBIN REVIEW. Vols. LI. and LII.

BRITTON'S ARCHITECTURAL ANTIQUITIES. Vol. III., No. 7., giving an account
of St. Nicholas' Chapel in King's Lynn, by Rev. Edw. Edwards, with Plate.
5_s_. will be given for this _separate Number_.

THE PROPHETIC MESSENGER, edited by Rev. J. Baylee of Birkenhead, Nos. 3.
and 15.

LA PRISON DE DARTMOOR, OU RÉCIT HISTORIQUE DES INFORTUNES, &c., DES
PRISONNIERS FRANÇAIS EN ANGLETERRE, &c. Par L. Catel. 8vo. 2 Tomes. Paris,
1847.

CURETON, PILLAR OF THE CREED OF THE SUNNITES.

POND'S CATALOGUE OF 1112 STARS REDUCED FROM OBSERVATIONS MADE AT GREENWICH
FROM 1816 TO 1833.

TAYLOR, A GENERAL CATALOGUE OF THE PRINCIPAL FIXED STARS, Madras, 1844.

MACDONALD, DISSERTATIO DE NECROSE ET CALLO, 1795. Edinburgh.

DIEFFENBACK, TRAVELS IN NEW ZEALAND. 4to. 1843.

DIANÆ (ANTON.) RESOLUTIONUM MORALIUM SUMMA. 4to.

* * * Letters, stating particulars and lowest price, _carriage free_, to be
sent to MR. BELL, Publisher of "NOTES AND QUERIES," 186. Fleet Street.

* * * * *

NOTICES TO CORRESPONDENTS.

OUR PROGRESS IN THE COLONIES. _We cannot resist bringing before our readers
the following passage from a letter which accompanied some very interesting
communications from_ ADELAIDE, SOUTH AUSTRALIA, _received by us this
week_:--

"_A lover and a student of all that is interesting or curious in literary
antiquity_, _my position necessarily debars me from all access to original
manuscripts_, _and to such volumes as are only to be found in large public
libraries_; _and also keeps me in ignorance of much that is going on in the
literary world_. _Thus there is a blank in the course of my favourite study
which is well filled up by your excellent and interesting periodical_. _It
is indeed a great boon to all situated as I am at a distance from the
fountain head of antiquarian knowledge._"

_Such an acknowledgment of our utility to our brethren abroad_, _is most
gratifying to us_. _We trust those of our readers who have friends and
relatives who are fond of literary pursuits_, _resident in the colonies_,
_will do them and us the kindness of directing their attention to_ "NOTES
AND QUERIES."

V. _is requested to say how we can address a letter to him_.

W. P. A. The Catalogue of Sir T. Phillip's MSS. _is privately printed_.
_There are copies_, _we believe_, _at the Bodleian_, _the Athenæum_, _and
the Society of Antiquaries._

E. B. P. _Correct in this supposition._

W. A. _The Camden Society could not undertake the publication of the
proposed_ Monumentarium Anglicanum, _without neglecting the objects for
which it was more immediately instituted_.

D. K.'s _Query was in type before we received his reminder_. _We do not
acknowledge the receipt of Queries_, _from an anxiety not to occupy space
unnecessarily_.

C. W. _and_ B. W. E. _are both thanked for the friendly tone of their
communications_.

X. Y. Z. HALLAM'S LITERATURE OF EUROPE. _The supplemental notes on the_
Literature of Europe _have not yet been incorporated in any edition of that
work_. _They form a separate volume adapted to all the existing editions._

MONUMENTARIUM ANGLICANUM. _We continue to receive valuable communications
upon this subject_, _which we shall take an early opportunity of bringing
before our Readers._

DE H. _A private communication awaits this correspondent_. _Will he furnish
us with his address?_

_Among many communications which we are this week obliged to postpone for
want of room_, _we may mention_ MR. PETER CUNNINGHAM'S _Reply to_ MR. FOSS
_on the_ Outer Temple--_An interesting paper on_ The Lay of The Last
Minstrel, _and many Replies_.

REPLIES RECEIVED. _Post Conquestum--Quakers' Attempt to Convert the
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of the Anti-Jacobin--Nullis Fraus, &c.--Meaning of Tye--Apple Pie
Order--Lancelot Lyttelton--Villenage--God takes those soonest--Sir H.
Slingsby--Inscription on a Clock--Christ's Cross Row--Four Want
Ways--Francis Moore--Witte van Hemstede--Dutch Church, Peter Sterry,
&c.--Mistletoe--Obeism--San Graal--Cleopatra--Auriga--Shakespeare's Use of
Delighted--Dutch Books._

VOLS. I. _and_ II., _each with very copious Index_, _may still be had_,
_price_ 9s. 6d. _each_.

NOTES AND QUERIES _may be procured_, _by order_, _of all Booksellers and
Newsvenders_. _It is published at noon on Friday_, _so that our country
Subscribers ought not to experience any difficulty in procuring it
regularly_. _Many of the country Booksellers_, _&c_., _are_, _probably_,
_not yet aware of this arrangement_, _which will enable them to receive_
NOTES AND QUERIES _in their Saturday parcels_.

_All communications for the Editor of_ NOTES AND QUERIES _should be
addressed to the care of_ MR. BELL, No. 186. Fleet Street.

* * * * *

{359}

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Review of New Publications, Reports of Antiquarian and other Societies,
Historical Chronicle; and OBITUARY, including Memoirs of the Earl of
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In the Press, Volumes III. and IV. of

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{360}

GILBERT'S GUIDE TO LONDON, with Map, &c. This original Work having long
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London: Published by JAMES GILBERT, 49. Paternoster Row. Orders received by
all Booksellers, Stationers, &c.

* * * * *

[Illustration]

GREAT EXHIBITION.

* * * * *

CENTRAL AVENUE.

* * * * *

An Illustrated Priced Catalogue of Church Furniture Contributed by

GILBERT J. FRENCH,
BOLTON, LANCASHIRE,

forwarded Free by Post on application.

* * * * *

Parcels delivered Carriage Free in London, daily.

* * * * *

Just published, No. VIII., price 2s. 6d., royal 4to.

DETAILS of GOTHIC ARCHITECTURE, measured and drawn from existing Examples
by J. K. COLLING, Architect.--CONTENTS: Font from Greetwell Church,
Lincolnshire; Window from Cottingham Church, Yorkshire; Pulpit from
Westminster Abbey; Chimney Shaft from Southwell Minster; Five examples of
Closing Rings.

London: GEORGE BELL, 186. Fleet Street.

* * * * *

Just published, a New Translation of

HEAVEN and ITS WONDERS; the WORLD of SPIRITS (or the intermediate Region,
which is the first receptacle of Man after Death); and HELL: described by
one who has heard and seen what he relates. From the Latin of EMANUEL
SWEDENBORG. Translated by the Rev. SAMUEL NOBLE. Second Edition, carefully
revised; with a New Preface, by the Translator, including Explanatory Notes
and Observations. Together with the original English Preface by the Rev.
THOMAS HARTLEY, A.M., Rector of Winwick, Northamptonshire. In 8vo. cloth,
price 5s.; or without Mr. Hartley's Preface, 4s.

HODSON, 22. Portugal Street, Lincoln's Inn; and all other Booksellers.

* * * * *

INSTRUCTIVE MUSIC.--HAMILTON'S MODERN INSTRUCTIONS for the PIANO,
Twenty-second Edition, 4s.; his Dictionary of 3,500 Musical Terms,
Thirty-fifth Edition, 1s.; Clarke's Catechism of the Rudiments of Music,
1s.; Clare's Psalmody, 12 books, 3s. each; Warren's Chanter's Hand Guide,
373 chants, 5s.; Psalmody, 2 vols. each 2s.; his Catechism of Class
Singing, 1s., Key to ditto, 1s.; his Easy Organ Tutor, 4s.; Hamilton's
Catechisms, 1 to 5, each 2s. and 3s.; Otto on the Violin, 3s.; Dubourg on
ditto, 5s.; Spohr's Great School for the Violin, 31s. 6d.; Campagnoli's
ditto, 24s.; Baillot's Method for the Violoncello, 12s.; Drouet's Method
for the Flute, 15s.; Berbiguer's Method, 12s.; Dressler's ditto, 9s.;
Richardson's Method, 2 books, 7s. 6d. each; Goodban's Method for the
Violin, 10s. 6d.; Hamilton's Catechism for the Organ, New Edition, 4s.;
Gottfried Weber's complete Theoretical Works, by John Bishop, 31s. 6d.;
Cherubini ditto on Counterpoint and Fugue, 31s. 6d.; Albrechtsberger's
complete Theoretical Works, 42s.; Mozart's Thorough Bass, 5s.; Done's
ditto, 4s.; and Danneley's Encyclopædia of Music, 6s.--London: R. COCKS and
Co., New Burlington Street, Publishers to Her Majesty.--N.B. A variety of
the most elegant Pianofortes (manufactured by Messrs. Cocks) from 22
Guineas upwards.--Price List with drawings gratis, and postage free. Pianos
on hire at 15s. per Month; Cocks's Musical Miscellany for May, 2d.,
Stamped, 3d.; S. Glover's Great Globe Quadrilles, 2d., Stamped, 3d.

* * * * *

Printed by THOMAS CLARK SHAW, of No. 8. New Street Square, at No. 5. New
Street Square, in the Parish of St Bride, in the City of London; and
published by GEORGE BELL, of No. 186. Fleet Street, in the Parish of St.
Dunstan in the West, in the City of London, Publisher, at No. 186 Fleet
Street aforesaid.--Saturday, May 3. 1851.

* * * * *

Corrections made to printed original.

page 352, "between the years 1825 and 1830" - original reads '1850' for the
second date, this corrected by the errata in issue 80.

*** End of this LibraryBlog Digital Book "Notes and Queries, Number 79, May 3, 1851 - A Medium of Inter-communication for Literary Men, Artists, - Antiquaries, Genealogists, etc" ***

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